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  1. #21
    Senior Member 22_Matt is on a distinguished road

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    Quote Originally Posted by capstan View Post
    The Vp mark has been used well beyond that time . Colt DS, Cobra and Agents even beyond 1978 are all stamped with the vp. So again, is the ad bogus or not?Maybe they just put this out as a marketing gimmick -on the other hand maybe they really did test the guns with "extra heavy" loads. If so, there is no such thing as an unfired colt with the vp stamp. Doc540 wanted to know about this very issue as his gunsmith thought the gun was unfired -factory or otherwise. I guess we'll never kniow.
    All modern manufactured firearms are proofed. You could say it's part of the manufacturing process. In some countries a gun must be reproofed if imported there, such as all of the New Services you see with English proof marks from WWI. I doubt that a company like Colt would have stamped their products with proof marks and not actually have done it. There is no such thing as unfired gun, as they all are proofed before leaving the factory. Firing one proof round, or five shots at a test target is not going to make a gun look like it's been fired enough to show signifigant wear. If the original purchaser never shot it, the gun will probably be clean enough where anyone would think it has never been fired. I have a S&W 34-1 that has no evidece of ever being fired, but I know it was, by the factory.
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  2. #22
    Senior Member sixgunshorty35717 is on a distinguished road

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    Quote Originally Posted by A1A View Post
    I believe Colt used the Verified Proof mark longer than that.
    You are correct....but the original post concerned the beginning of the VP era

  3. #23
    A1A
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    Yes, that was just a gentle disagreement with the 1940 limitation because I know it has been continued long beyond that.

  4. #24
    Senior Member gunpoor is on a distinguished road

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    Quote Originally Posted by A1A View Post
    All colt guns have the mark.
    Not so, the Colt Junior pocket automatic never had the VP proof stamp. Not even the ones made in CT. Which is very odd because its predecessor the 1908 pocket 25 acp, like all colt autos, has the VP proof of the trigger guard. Guess that model didn't earn its mark of quality.
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  5. #25
    Supporting Member JudgeColt will become famous soon enough JudgeColt will become famous soon enough
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    Quote Originally Posted by gunpoor View Post
    Not so, the Colt Junior pocket automatic never had the VP proof stamp. Not even the ones made in CT. Which is very odd because its predecessor the 1908 pocket 25 acp, like all colt autos, has the VP proof of the trigger guard. Guess that model didn't earn its mark of quality.
    The reason the Colt Junior, which was made in Spain by Astra, does not have the Verified Proof is because it was not MADE by Colt.

    The reason the Colt Automatic .25, which was made in Florida by Firearms International, does not have the Verified Proof is because it was not MADE by Colt.

    I have never heard of either the Junior or Automatic .25 being made in Connecticut. Please tell me about these previously unknown pistols.

  6. #26
    Senior Member gunpoor is on a distinguished road

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    Quote Originally Posted by JudgeColt View Post
    The reason the Colt Junior, which was made in Spain by Astra, does not have the Verified Proof is because it was not MADE by Colt.

    The reason the Colt Automatic .25, which was made in Florida by Firearms International, does not have the Verified Proof is because it was not MADE by Colt.

    I have never heard of either the Junior or Automatic .25 being made in Connecticut. Please tell me about these previously unknown pistols.
    Sorry Judge I must have been mistaken. I wasn't aware that when the Junior was banned from importation under the Gun Control Act of 1968, because they were deemed “unfit for sporting practices”, that Colt moved production to Firearms International for the last few years. I was under the impression they just moved production in house in CT. I guess I was mistaken.
    Last edited by gunpoor; 09-22-2009 at 07:24 AM.
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  7. #27
    A1A
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    As I stated in another recent thread, it's getting to be that you have to be a lawyer to post. The essential issue in the recent additions to this post as I see it was whether the VP mark was a selective thing within Colt based upon being test fired (good) or possibly not (bad) brought on by the claims in a relatively old ad and possibly the concern that if a gun didn't have a target shipped with it, it might not have been test fired and marked. My response apparently should have been that the VP mark was on all Colts actually made by Colt from 1902 or 1905, depending on who you believe, except for some inconsistency in its application to some SAAs, and except for factory errors and other weird circumstances. Additionally, note that the ad relates targets to perceived target guns which have an additional accuracy requirement beyond just not blowing up. All good information though.

  8. #28
    Senior Member capstan is on a distinguished road

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    OK lets ask one more time: IF the gun has the Vp stamp, does that mean the gun has been factory fired with "extra heavy" loads as the ad specifically says? Who on this forum thinks that is the case? (The main question seems to have been forgotten in all the discussion about When the vp stamp was used.)

  9. #29
    Senior Member Old-Colts is on a distinguished road

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    Quote Originally Posted by capstan View Post
    OK lets ask one more time: IF the gun has the Vp stamp, does that mean the gun has been factory fired with "extra heavy" loads as the ad specifically says? Who on this forum thinks that is the case? (The main question seems to have been forgotten in all the discussion about When the vp stamp was used.)
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  10. #30
    A1A
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    The main question seems to have been forgotten in all the discussion about When the vp stamp was used.
    Yep, and what we have on that topic from 22_Matt is this:

    All modern manufactured firearms are proofed. You could say it's part of the manufacturing process. In some countries a gun must be reproofed if imported there, such as all of the New Services you see with English proof marks from WWI. I doubt that a company like Colt would have stamped their products with proof marks and not actually have done it. There is no such thing as unfired gun, as they all are proofed before leaving the factory. Firing one proof round, or five shots at a test target is not going to make a gun look like it's been fired enough to show significant wear.
    So, if you accept that, it means that yes, firing is part of the process signified by the VP mark. Whether or not extra heavy loads are used is another question. What was extra heavy at the time of the ad might have been different from what would be considered that at an earlier or later time. Because the ad is older, I wouldn't get hung up on the words, but it would be interesting to know what Colt actually did/does use for that purpose. It would also be interesting to hear from someone absolutely in the know, that Colts quality process didn't get so shoddy at some time that the proofing was indeed overlooked. I am not that person.


 

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