Serial Numbers on colt Police Positive

[Frankt]

I read somewhere where Colt Police Positive Special in .38 Special and .32 S&W Long shared serial numbers. Is this true and what exactly do they mean. Are they saying you can have a .32 S&W Long with X serial number and also have one in .38 Special with the same number. Thanks Frank

[dfariswheel]

Colt factory records show only one serial number range for all calibers in the Police Positive Special.

It was the Police Positive that had different serial ranges for the .38 and .32 models and in which you could have two guns with the same serial.

[A1A]

I think that there are two points involved. One is that a model had a range of serial number assignments regardless of caliber. In other words, there was not a set of serial numbers for a PPSs in .38 Special and another for PPSs in other calibers. However, prior to 1968, serial numbers did not have to be unique, so it is possible (even assured) that there are different models with the same serial number. Look in the Proofhouse charts at Police positive Special and see that they were numbered from 1 to 900101 prior to 1968. Note also that the Police Positive 38 (38 on a 38 frame model) was numbered from 1 to 406725 up to 1943 during the same period and the Police Positive .32 (a 32 frame model) had numbers in that range from 1913 to 1943. That is why it is important to properly identify the model when dating. Other models like the New Service and Trooper and Python even started at 1 and just ran sequential numbers up to 1968. Of course, those are easier to distinguish.

[Frankt]

Ok then it is possible to hace a Colt Positive Special in 38 and one in 32 with the same serial number. Thanks Frank

[A1A]

Ok then it is possible to hace a Colt Positive Special in 38 and one in 32 with the same serial number. Thanks Frank

That's not what we said. We said there are no duplicate serial numbers on Police Positive Specials (or within any other model) regardless of caliber. A Police Positive 38 (not Special) or Police Positive 32 (not Special) are different models from a Police Positive Special (which was available in several calibers) and from each other.

[Frankt]

I am sorry if I mis understood. But what did you mean by (However, prior to 1968, serial numbers did not have to be unique, so it is possible (even assured) that there are different models with the same serial number) in the above post. Frank

[Oyeboten]

Police Positive .38 ( ie: .38 S & W or .38 New Police Cartridge ) were serial Numbered unto themselves, which started at Serial No. 1 in 1905.

Police Positive .32 and Target, ditto, which started in 1907 at Serial No. 49,500.

Police Positive Specials, ( ie: .38 Special Cartridge ) ditto, which started at Serial No. 1, in 1908.

Police Posiitive .22 and Target Models G and C, ditto, which started at Serial No. 1, in 1910.

Pocket Positive had their own serial Numbers, which started at Serial No. 30,000 in 1905.


Leaving aside the larger Frame DA Revolvers of the same era...


So...between them all...

It is possible one find several different Models of Colt DA Revolvers of the early 20th Century, which could/would have the same Serial Number.

[Frankt]

This serial number thing can get a bit confusing. I guess I figured that if a manufacture started producing a certain gun they would start with serial number one and go forward. And if they decided to come out with a different model they would start with serial number one and go forward. But when the other post said ( We said there are no duplicate serial numbers on Police Positive Specials (or within any other model) regardless of caliber.) I got confused. This seams to contradict with what you said. (It is possible one find several different Models of Colt DA Revolvers of the early 20th Century, which could/would have the same Serial Number).

[A1A]

This is some of the ATF Guidebook based on, among other things, the Gun Control Act of 1968. Scroll down to Identification of Firearms, Marking Requirements and note the first question. The key words in the answer to licensed manufacturers or importers are "must not duplicate any serial number placed by you on any other firearm".

ATF Online - Firearms - Guides - Importation & Verification of Firearms, Ammunition and Implements of War - Firearms Verification Overview

Prior to this there was no such restriction and serial numbers indeed were typically started at 1 for each model, allowing duplicate numbers from model to model. The objective of this new requirement on manufacturers and importers was to allow law enforcement be able to trace a gun to the first buyer which would be from a licensed dealer and thus solve gun related crimes.

Oh, and I am not a lawyer, just a searcher.

[A1A]

This serial number thing can get a bit confusing. I guess I figured that if a manufacture started producing a certain gun they would start with serial number one and go forward. And if they decided to come out with a different model they would start with serial number one and go forward. But when the other post said ( We said there are no duplicate serial numbers on Police Positive Specials (or within any other model) regardless of caliber.) I got confused. This seams to contradict with what you said. (It is possible one find several different Models of Colt DA Revolvers of the early 20th Century, which could/would have the same Serial Number).

I think your confusion is not with the numbers, but the models. The Police Positive Special is a model. The Police Positive 38 is a model. The Police Positive 32 is a model. The Police Positive Special was the only one that could be chambered for .38 Special, but it was also available in other calibers such as 38 New Police and 32 New Police. No two Police Positive Specials regardless of caliber would have the same serial number. No two Police Positive 38s would have the same serial number. No two Police Positive 32s would have the same serial number. But a Police Positive Special could have the same serial number as a Police Positive 38 and/or a Police Positive 32. After circa 1968, that sort of thing could no longer happen (legally). Does that help?