.38 HBWC loaded backwards--do they stabilize?

[Eldon Hickey]

I frequently see posts recommending this load for defense. It looked like a great idea to me back in the 70's and I loaded a bunch of 148gr Speer HBWC backwards over 3 gr of Bullseye. I was a bit surprised and disheartened to note at the range that most of them went through the target sideways at 5 yards from my Chief's special. Has anyone come up with a bullet/powder/gun combination that will stabilize these loads or do people keep recommending them because they look scary?

[porsche]

I don't use them like that due to poor accuracy but some report otherwise.

[capstan]

I had the same results as porsche- poor accuracy

[guy sajer]

For close range defense use maybe it's ok for it to tumble a little . Just thinking out loud .

[DFrame]

I don't use them. Like others here I've not had good luck with accuracy. They are also frequently swaged and extremely soft. As such I think they would be difficult to drive to the velocities I would wish a defensive load to achieve. If I load wadxutters for this purpose I would use solid base hard cast bullets driven to much higher velocities.

[Oyeboten]

Thinking out load here also...

One could probably lightly glue in some sort of Ball ( Nylon, Plastic, Lead, Steel, Glass, probably anything would do ) on to the Hollow end, and, this would both correct the aerodynamic instability, and, permit the Bullet to act more like the old 'Powerball' on impact.

If the Ball were large enough, the same Bullet ( of 148 Grain ) would probably function well in .38 ACP, .38 Super, 9mm Browning Long, 9mm Bergman/Largo, 9mm P-'o8, or other similar diameter Bullet Cartridges, since the Ball-end modification of the HBWC loaded backwards, would allow the Cartridge to feed, while a plain HBWC loaded backwards, would not permit the Cartridge to feed well or would not feed at all, in most traditional Autamotics.


Othewise, as others have mentioned also, I think the plain DEWC, in 158 Grain, driven to anywhere above 700 FPS, would represent a very good option for any short Barrel SD-Carry Revolver...and if driven much past that, and if a softer or dead-soft Alloy, would likely expand well enough anyway, while the open end of a HBWC facing forward, whether it had a Ball in it or not, if driven very fast, would over-expand too soon and not offer adequate penetration, especially if Winter weight or heavy Clothing is present.

Be nice if someone would do some Ballistic's Gelletain Block tests with these to see what they seem to do at various FPS.

[Eldon Hickey]

Thanks all for the replies. Kind of confirmed my suspicions.

[WIL TERRY]

IT seems to me everyone here forgot the salient feature of loading 38HBWC bullets backwards and shooting them accurately. MANY years ago when all this was the newest-and-the-bestest [ we must read gun history or we are condemned to repeat it...] it was learned that to get good results you used the SPEER 148gr HBWC bullets with the slightly recessed nose to which was fitted and crimped in place one[1] HORNADY gas check. WOW !!! Guess what happened now when that bullet was loaded upside down in 38SPL brass over the appropriate charge of propellent ??? [.....i won't spoil the surprise for you...
And so it goes..

[oberon]

I do not intend to use any handload as a defense round. Not because of reliability or performance issues, but from the perspective that the prosecutor or other adversarial attorney might take in such a case.
Q: 'Did you use the less powerful handload in an effort to inflict a non lethal crippling & maiming injury? Or did you use the high powered handload to completely blow my client to pieces?' 'Are you a sadistic, evil person, bent on destruction and mayhem?'
Either way, a lawyer can use your defensive handload against you.
I have only good factory loads on hand for those special social occaisions.
And I do like the dead lead HBWC for shootin' fodder. I suppose there is a factory load of it, and that would be ok.

[Eldon Hickey]

IT seems to me everyone here forgot the salient feature of loading 38HBWC bullets backwards and shooting them accurately. MANY years ago when all this was the newest-and-the-bestest [ we must read gun history or we are condemned to repeat it...] it was learned that to get good results you used the SPEER 148gr HBWC bullets with the slightly recessed nose to which was fitted and crimped in place one[1] HORNADY gas check. WOW !!! Guess what happened now when that bullet was loaded upside down in 38SPL brass over the appropriate charge of propellent ??? [.....i won't spoil the surprise for you...
And so it goes..

Terry, Have you actually tried this with good results?