Jeff Cooper's idea
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  1. #1
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    Jeff Cooper\'s idea

    Somewhere, I read an article by Jeff Cooper. He said something like, "the ideal handgun should be about the size of a pack of cigarettes, weigh about the same as a package of gum, have a maximum effective range of about 100 yards and the knock-down power of .458 Winchester." (SOMETHING like that, but you get the idea.) So, with this view in mind, I'll state my case and ask for your thoughts. 1. I want to have two handguns in my personal battery. (There will be more, but I'm not counting target pistols or historical interest here.) 2. The first is essentially the "holster gun." Size is no particular consequence but choice will include points for weight and overall size with an eye to, "smaller and lighter beats larger and heavier." This gun should be .38 caliber or better. Extra points for,"better." (I've just acquired a 1957 vintage Colt, ".357," 6" that I like very much.) 3. The second gun is for concealed carry, in a PROPER HOLSTER WITH BELT - but extra points for, "pocket optional carry." The holster-method would have to go under a business suit or windbreaker. "Pocket carry," is just that. (Right, front of blue jeans is what I have in mind.)4. Interchangeable bullets would be a plus. 5. Action type is open to discussion. I'm very fond of being able to, "top off," the gun, after one or two shots - the Garand rifle problem comes to mind. I'm only buying two guns, so, "money is no object." (It feels very good to even type those words!) But if both guns cannot be had for less than $2500, I'll spend my money on whiskey and drink until the pistol-shooting urge passes. So, guys ... what's yer thoughts? (As I write this, I know of a dealer near by that has a, "like new," Colt .380 General's pistol for sale for $700 and I'm interested.) Talk me into/out of something ... I like the conversation!

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    Re: Jeff Cooper\'s idea

    Ok for some conversation, I say dump the semi idea and replace it with a Detective Special. Install a hammer shroud on the DS and you would have IMO the perfect pocket gun. Six sure shots of +P rated 158gr .38sp even when fired while still in pocket (be aware of pocket fires).
    But that's my $.02 worth and it won't even buy bubble gum these days.

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    Re: Jeff Cooper\'s idea

    1. For the holster, a 6" Python, preferably nickel plated. Not exactly smaller and lighter but in a good holster who cares? Shoots good, looks baaaaad!
    2. For CCW, a shrouded Detective Special (or in lieu of a shroud just bob the hammer). Should be worn in an original Roy Baker pancake holster under a coat. Can also be worn IWB with an untucked shirt. May be kept in a pocket, depending on the size of the pocket, but why bother when you can go IWB.
    3. Lucky for me I have both of these!

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    -Gun control means using both hands-
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    Re: Jeff Cooper\'s idea

    For Mr.'s majik and ab4ka, thanks for the suggestions. I'm close to the Python with my present, ".357," from 1957, 6" but blue, unfortunately. What I'd like to ask both you gents is more about your recommendation of the DS. Particular vintage? I used to have a second issue Cobra and traded it off when I got scared about the alloy frame business, but it shot very well and I loved the action. The newer version's sights are so low - seems to me. Doesn't this muck things up? And I've wondered about the shorter grip, too ... doesn't seem as comfortable as the older, longer version. What can you tell me about the, "alloy nerves?" Has that been straigtened out? I notice both you gents say the DS and don't mention the Cobra nor Agent. Can you really stick one of these in a pants pocket and not look like you're very glad to see someone?!

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    Re: Jeff Cooper\'s idea

    The DS is heavier, but with a pocket holster and the right cut of pants it will work. The holster breaks up the outline of the revolver which is the dead give away.
    I personally prefer the 3rd gen DS with the covered extractor rod. Not that it's needed, but just one less thing to snag if needed in a hurry.
    I chose the shroud over bobbing the hammer because the shroud still allows you to thumb cock the revolver for single action shooting.
    Pachmyer makes a nice hand filling stock for D-frames that are a tad longer and gives room for the pinky finger.
    Cobras and Agents also will do a fine job, but you will have to use standard .38sp and no +P's. The +P loads are where the .38sp really shine in short barrelled revolvers

    [This message has been edited by Majic (edited 10-04-2003).]

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    Re: Jeff Cooper\'s idea

    10-4, Mr. majic. Thanks for the clarification ... never seen a, "pocket holster," except in pictures on the web. I'll check 'em out. Thanks. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Majic:
    The DS is heavier, but with a pocket holster and the right cut of pants it will work. The holster breaks up the outline of the revolver which is the dead give away.
    I personally prefer the 3rd gen DS with the covered extractor rod. Not that it's needed, but just one less thing to snag if needed in a hurry.
    I chose the shroud over bobbing the hammer because the shroud still allows you to thumb cock the revolver for single action shooting.
    Pachmyer makes a nice hand filling stock for D-frames that are a tad longer and gives room for the pinky finger.
    Cobras and Agents also will do a fine job, but you will have to use standard .38sp and no +P's. The +P loads are where the .38sp really shine in short barrelled revolvers

    [This message has been edited by Majic (edited 10-04-2003).]
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


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    Re: Jeff Cooper\'s idea

    I also like the DS and cose the Lou Alessi for my pocket holster. It's worked well for me for some time.

    I left the hammer as is and I've never had a problem with it snagging yet. IMHO, having a good holster that not only protects the gun and breaks up the outline but that holds it upright in your pocket so you can get it out when needed is the most important part.
    Fore Warned is Fore Armed... Pogo
    Unless it's four worned out guns... Albert

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    Re: Jeff Cooper\'s idea

    I love the back page of Guns & Ammo every month, with Jeff Cooper holding court.

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    Re: Jeff Cooper\'s idea

    My personal concealed carry "pocket gun" is a 5 shot S&W model 38 Bodyguard. It is a pre-1960 model and limited to Standard Velocity .38's. I prefer the pocket method for carry for this size and feel if I am putting it on the belt then put a bigger gun on a belt.



    I do also have a Colt "Agent" that was planned to be an option for the pocket. It was a newer version in the budget line. Parkerized finish, shrouded barrel. The plan was to pack it with the hammer bobbed. A set of "Barami Hip Grip" stocks with a Tyler T-Grip. Easy draw and thumb cocking was possible just not as easy (or the safest). Slide it in the waistband on occasion when needed.



    This project is on hold due to the need for repair and I have been so happy with the S&W as to not feel the push for the extra round.

    As for the "Big" gun... you have a fine example of one already in your 6" .357.

    I will add however that my GLOCK model 26 has won my heart as the best modern pistol for my needs. Works in the pocket, on a belt, by the nightstand, shoots straight and shoots harder than a .38 special. from 10+ rounds to 33in the magazine. a most versatile weapon. It has been getting a lot of "face time" lately.



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