I'm still puzzlin'.......................
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  1. #1
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    I'm still puzzlin'.......................

    I have sent a letter off to the "Dope Bag," a feature of the American Rifleman. The question I'm puzzling over is the revolvers submitted by both Colt and Smith & Wesson to the US Army test trials of 1907. Supposedly these were double action revolvers chambered for the .45 caliber M1906 revolver cartridge. This cartridge was made up by Frankford Arsenal in 1905 and 1906 in a rimmed version for revolvers, and a rimless version for automatic pistols. All guns to be considered had to be made for either of these two rounds. I'm assuming the Colt revolvers submitted were commercial New Service revolvers. The American Rifleman article states that a Colt M1909 revolver, in .45 ACP was submitted for the 1910 tests.

    I believe the Colt revolver was chambered for the M1906 revolver cartridge, and would have accommodated the .45 Auto round without the use of half moon clips, which weren't invented until the 1917 revolvers were purchased. If these guns were chambered, that is had the shoulder, then a .45 ACP round would have functioned quite well, though extraction would have been by the No.2 yellow wooden pencil.

    I'm awaiting the NRA's response.


    Bob Wright

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    Let us know what you hear, please.

    Many NRA members don't know about this member benefit......
    If you send a S.A.S.E. envelope with ONE question, the American Rifleman Dope Bag Tech Staff will attempt to answer it.
    They have people on staff like Bruce Canfield and a lot of history documentation records.
    Kerz likes this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dfariswheel View Post
    Let us know what you hear, please.
    You can count on that.

    Bob Wright
    Mosby likes this.

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    They don't always get it right. A few years back they featured a pre-WWII Colt National Match which they described as being "factory original". Problem was it had a huge set of after-market sights. I contacted them and got a reply back admitting they got it wrong.

    Experts are just like the rest of us; they make mistakes too. Years ago a friend and I were at the ArkLaTex gun show in Shreveport, Louisiana. My friend had bought a really nice original H&R M1 Rifle, and we ran into Bruce Canfield who wanted to look at it. He told my friend that it was a nice rifle, but had the wrong barrel as it was a LMR barrel as used by International Harvester. There was no doubt that the barrel was original to the rifle, but we didn't argue the point. When Scott Duff brought out his second book on the M1 Rifle he had serial number lists in the back, and there in the serial number range of my friend's rifle was a group of H&R rifles with LMR barrels. H&R was running short of barrels and the military had LMR barrels sent to H&R to continue production.
    Kerz likes this.

  6. #5
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    There was a time in the early 1800's when it was still possible for one person to know EVERYTHING known to mankind.
    A person could see every work of art, read every book or manuscript, and know everything about medicine, engineering, and science.

    Today it's impossible for one person to know everything about ANY one subject.
    No one knows everything, which is why among Colt owners this site flourishes.

    There's an old line that goes....
    Some people know more and more about less and less until they know everything about nothing.
    Some people know less and less about more and more until they know nothing about everything.
    Last edited by dfariswheel; 06-23-2019 at 10:38 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dfariswheel View Post
    There's an old line that goes....
    Some people know more and more about less and less until they know everything about nothing.
    Some people know less and less about more and more until they know nothing about everything.
    That perfectly describes our political class.
    bearcat6 likes this.
    Socialism is like a Jedi Mind Trick...it only works on the weak minded. SnidelyWhiplash
    I'm an American. Your approval is not required. SnidelyWhiplash
    Good people do not need laws to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws. Plato



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    Further information on the M1906 revolvers was obtained over on the Smith & Wesson Forum. From data there supplied by a correspondent, Smith & Wesson made up their Triple Lock Model chamber ed for the M1906 cartridge. In fact, it appears S&W thought of the possibility of offering the revolver/cartridge combination as the commercial .45 S&W Special.

    At least two S&W Triple Lock revolvers are known to exist in the .45 M1906 chambering.

    Bob Wright

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    Quote Originally Posted by dfariswheel View Post
    There was a time in the early 1800's when it was still possible for one person to know EVERYTHING known to mankind.
    The notion is right. But the timing is wrong. That ended by mid XIVth century.

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    One of the Colt revolvers was the standard New Service chambered for the 1906 cartridge, where the second Colt revolver was a New Service with a frame and cylinder shortened by approximately 1/3 inch, built to accommodate only the 1906 cartridge. I believe the standard New Service would have had tapered chambers, but no shoulder to headspace the automatic cartridge.

    The Webley-Fosbery Automatic Revolver was also entered in the tests.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyP View Post
    One of the Colt revolvers was the standard New Service chambered for the 1906 cartridge, where the second Colt revolver was a New Service with a frame and cylinder shortened by approximately 1/3 inch, built to accommodate only the 1906 cartridge. I believe the standard New Service would have had tapered chambers, but no shoulder to headspace the automatic cartridge.

    The Webley-Fosbery Automatic Revolver was also entered in the tests.
    Those Webley-Fosbery revolvers aren't too scarce as I've seen and been able to handle one, but the Colt and Smith & Wesson revolvers are virtually non-existent. And I've never even heard of the small framed New Service.

    Bob Wright


 
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