Substitue Black Powder and corrision in your old black powder Colts
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Thread: Substitue Black Powder and corrision in your old black powder Colts

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    Substitue Black Powder and corrision in your old black powder Colts

    I run a Longrifle forum and one of our members is Bill Knight (AKA Mad Monk). Bill has posted much information on substitute black powders and you may be interested in what he has say about using it in lieu of real black powder. I searched for a thread that gave good information by Bill and also some of our regular members. I AM NOT trying to convince anyone to use or not use a particular type of powder in our old Colts (and others) but just want to make you aware of concerns many have.

    Here is the link, there are three pages of discussion and several in there by "Mad Monk" and as I mentioned he is the most knowledgeable person I know on the subject. No membership is needed to read the posts, only to reply.
    Click here: Sub Powders & Corrosion

    tdennis
    Rich N likes this.

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    I don't want to have to go read 3 pages on an outside forum I'm not a member of. What, if anything, is the consensus, there, since you read it?
    Last edited by azshot; 04-12-2019 at 10:04 AM.

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    Thanks for the link. Yes this comes up once in awhile. I gave up on 'real' black powder (in quotes because from what I have read todays hard fouling BP is a far cry from the softer fouling BP of the 1800s) a couple of decades ago due to terrible accuracy after a few shots. Have been shooting pyrodex or, now, 777 ever since. As long as I clean promptly I have had ZERO issues. Rebuilt an 1892 Winchester with a brand new barrel in 44-40 back in the late 80s. Pyrodex nonstop since maybe the mid 90s. Bore is still like a mirror after thousands of rounds. Same with all my old guns... a trapdoor bought in 1998, etc....zero issues. Just like BP, if you clean with water, then promptly oil, no issues. Delay it a day...issues. And I live in HUMID Ohio, where EVERYTHING rusts.
    I looked over the link and will certainly read it in depth tomorrow...but when you see statements made by others like "We can all hope their bores dissolve rapidly" (second post in your link) it kind of makes me wonder about bias (besides that...why the venom from a fellow shooter???).
    I have bias too and will admit it up front: I WANT to use BP! Unfortunately extensive accuracy testing (that would satisfy any statistician) of BP vs Pyrodex in probably over 30 guns in the last 30 years had made Pyrodex (or 777) the clear winner in my personal guns.
    waltesefalcon likes this.

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    I have been shooting BP for around thirty years. I have used a lot of the real stuff and a lot of Pyrodex and, like Dan says, if you clean and oil your guns after a day at the range you'll never have a problem. That's the way I was taught by my dad, I think some of these issues arise when you have guys who think BP guns are cool but don't want to take the time to do the cleaning they require so the guns wind up sitting for awhile before getting cleaned.
    dandak, Dave_T and hearsedriver like this.
    Cheers,
    Walter

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    The simple elegant solution to all the sad and sorry Black Powder woes, is this -

    Melt some Bees Wax in a clean empty Tuna Can or low Cat Food Can or the likes, and have it in a Cake Pan or Skillet of Water so it is like a sort of 'double boiler' only open...small Frying Pan is fine.

    Tear 1 inch wide strips of ordinary Paper Towels, and run them through the molten Bees Wax, like a "U" one holds both ends of.

    Lay them out to cool and dry on some aluminum Foil.

    Take a Gasket Hole Punch which will cut Discs out of the Wax impregnated Paper Towel strips, and use it over smooth end grain Pine or smooth end grain scrap 2x4 or whatever, always cut Discs over end grain wood, never long grain...use a Punch which will cut out discs which will be a little larger in diameter, than whatever Caliber one is going to be shooting....whether for Cap & Ball or Metallic Cartridge.

    The Disc goes between the Black Powder, and whatever Ball or Bullet.

    This simple method stops all fouling, ends all Revolver 'binding', hard fouling, mess, smudges, crud build up, smudges on face, etc.

    It Lubes the Bullet or Ball's passage down the Barrel, and later on, all one finds if one finds anything at all, is a few traces of super thin whispy light grey film, which one can wipe off with a Thumb or Kleenex.

    I fired over quite a few hundred rounds over a most of a year ( no cleaning during any of it ) using Goex, with my "as new" Blue Uberti "Walker" who's Cylinder to Forcing cone gap is about .003, looked just as clean and nice after all those rounds as it had before I had started, no fouling whatever, no 'binding'...no rust blooming either ( but this was Las Vegas, so a more humid clime, who knows?)

    Hot Soapy Water Cleaning once the Day is Done for clean-up, and Oil / Lube the Revolver for storage or put-away, as usual.

    Try it...

    You'll see..!
    Last edited by Oyeboten; 04-09-2019 at 02:55 PM.

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    I have used old felt hats and beeswax to make wads before but never thought about using paper towels.
    Cheers,
    Walter

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    Quote Originally Posted by waltesefalcon View Post
    I have used old felt hats and beeswax to make wads before but never thought about using paper towels.
    Black Powder Hand Gun or Rifle ( use two I'd guess for Rifle! ), the Bee's Wax impregnated Paper Towel 'Disc' is only about .020 odd thousandths thick...takes up no room, and vaporizes entirely, which it is meant do to, for the Bee's Wax Lube to work properly in both Lubing the Bullet-Bore and neutralizing fouling.

    It's perfect..!
    Last edited by Oyeboten; 04-10-2019 at 04:52 PM.

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    I'll have to try that out sometime.

    I use the felt hat wads in my revolvers, in my rifle I just use good old cotton patches in Crisco.
    Last edited by waltesefalcon; 04-12-2019 at 08:00 AM.
    Cheers,
    Walter

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    Back in my NSSA (North South Skirmish Association) days we used a 50/50 combination of bees wax and Crisco to lubricate 58 cal minie balls. This stuff kept fowling soft, often while hundreds of rounds were rapidly fired during competitive events. No cleaning was done during those events as I recall, I know I never did it. At the end of the day most of us just poured hot water (often boiling hot) down the barrels, mopped the bore with hot water patches until they came out clean. Barrels dried out pretty quick after a few dry patches since they were pretty hot after being heated by boiling/near boiling water. Barrels, cones, and locks, was then oiled and the guns put away until the next shoot.

    Minie balls have a lot of surfaces in addition to several groves to hold lubricant, but I wonder if dipping round ball or conical bullet in similar lubricant would work just as well.

    Can't understand why modern black power should be any different from what was made 150 or more years ago. It's pretty simple stuff. Modern equivalents may be cleaner to use but they sure takes away from the good ole' fashion way these guns were designed to work.

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    I've shot and been pretty involved in black powder since the 1970s. In the 1990s I shot BPCR matches. We ALL used real blackpowder, after finding out the substitutes offered sub-standard accuracy. I remember being at the Whittington Center before a National match, sitting in the competitor's housing pulling ALL my bullets and dumping the Pyrodex before the next day's match. I'd spent the day getting sight settings, and having what I thought was good accuracy in my Shiloh Sharps. My spotter said "what the heck are your loads, this is terrible?!" I told him Pyrodex and all up and down the line it was like someone yelled "bomb!" in an airport. I was given a can of Goex (you couldn't buy real black powder in my town then), and reloaded EVERY round that night with BP for the next day. Did pretty good too!

    The ASSRA (American Single Shot Rifle Asso), all the BPCR guys, schuetzen, and many other serious accuracy hounds have proven again and again only real black powder will give the best accuracy in the average Sharps, Ballard, Hepburn, Stevens, or any long range target rifle. I'm talking minimum 200 yards, and 500 and 1000 yards here, not 25 yds pistol.

    Both real and replica powders foul and corrode. You have to learn how to use them to reduce both. I'll always shoot black, would never mess with replica again.
    waltesefalcon and old tanker like this.


 
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