It is 45 Colt.

People started calling it the "long" Colt in the 1880's to distinguish it from the 45 Schofield.
The Schofield round has slipped into oblivion (almost), but people still refer to the 45 Colt as the long Colt.

The correct name is 45 Colt.

 

.45 Long Colt is a more colloquial name given by those who either don't know better or simply to differentiate it from the .45 ACP or the .45 Schofield as noted above. I think most today wouldn't even know the .45 Schofield. The name .45 Colt is its official name by SAMMI which governs ammunition standards (best descriptor I can give it). I think most familiar with firearms and calibers know the difference and don't make a big deal of it.

 

Thank you for your answers. I do know the info above. I was hoping to get historical data that shows that it was given the name of 45 Colt.

 

As stated by every post above, the name is "the 45 Colt". I've also heard that the "Long Colt" miss-naming was to distinguish the older cartridge from the Schofield or more correctly the 45 Smith & Wesson, and the 45 ACP. Why isn't Schofield, or S&W, or ACP distinction enough from the original 45 Colt? Why does it have to further distinguished by adding "Long"?

Dave

 

Check out the Colt website listing for the SAA. Caliber listed as 45LC. Just sayin’

Tom

 

Colt letters also list the Super .38 as .38 Super. They don't always get it correct.

 

The earliest boxes were labelled "Colt's Revolver, Cal .45" or "Revolver Ball Cartridges, Calibre .45" But within a year or two catalogs, boxes, and actual head stamps were always ".45 Colt". The "long" slang came shortly thereafter.

Just because people call something a .30-40 Krag today, doesn't mean it didn't start as a .30 USG. Or the .30-06, which started as.... and so on. People may coin a term and the ammo and reloading companies eventually start doing it too. That doesn't mean it's the name it STARTED with, which is what he's asking.

 

 

As all the others have stated the correct name is 45 Colt. But it's also one of those terms that through incorrect common usage you either accept or get wound up about, like clip/magazine, grips/stocks, or SAA for any single action clone that's not a Colt. I've gotten to the point where while I use the correct terms (I slip once in a while), I'm not really bothered by those who use the wrong terms. What it does when I hear the incorrect terms is that it immediately tells me a great deal about the actual knowledge of the person speaking.

Best regards,

 

Look here to see some examples of government issue .45 ammunition...A look at the .45 Colt/Schofield boxes...........

To further confuse things, when the Army introduced the Model 1909 revolver it enlarged the rims to ensure more positive extraction. Good in the big New Service cylinder, but t was only possible to load three in an SAA cylinder as the rims tried to overlap.

 

Hello and welcome to the Colt Forum from West Virginia. Glad you have joined us here. A little more history here of the Colt .45 >>>>>>>>>

https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a23685/colt-single-action/

 

 

Maybe you should ask them to show a 45 Short Colt cartridge? If they cannot do this, then you are correct!

 

There was a short 45 Colt, see below.

But the history of our language is so riddled with misnomers it can drive you crazy if you let it! The 45 Colt vs. 45 Long Colt certainly is a common one especially among knowledgeable gun people.


History of the unofficial 45 Long Colt description:

As soon as those unaware of the 'short' 45 Colt, learn of its existence, the discussion can end.
Although there was initially a justification for the long 45 Colt description, it preceded the short 45 Colt Rem-UMC round by decades.

Shortly after the Army procured S&W Schofield revolvers, the 1st time a supply depot accidentally shipped 45 Colt ammo to a unit issued the 45 S&W Schofield revolvers (needing the shorter S&W round), the Army figured out it had a multiple ammunition problem! Coincidentally troops were complaining about the recoil of the original Colt ~40gr load of blackpowder and resulting poor marksmanship.

Soon the original ~40gr load was reduced to 28 grs. Then government arsenals established the 45 S&W round as standard in 1887 since it would chamber in both the 45 Colt SAA and S&W revolvers.

Since the 45 Colt cartridge inventory was not depleted for some time, those troopers who appreciated the superior performance of the 45 Colt round and were issued the 45 Colt SAA, specifically requested the longer round, the “long Colt” round with small L.

Remington-UMC did actually introduce a “short” 45 Colt round before WW I. It’s not a Remington version of the 45 Schofield because it has a narrower and thicker rim like the 45 Colt and will not chamber in S&W Schofield revolvers.
It’s simply head-stamped 45 Colt. It’s of similar length to the Schofield round but is not the same as the Schofield round because it has the standard, small 45 Colt rim size. It does not properly extract from the Schofield revolvers. I have several factory loaded rounds and cases which are balloon head cases. The headstamps of the Remington short 45 Colt and the 45 Schofield were always different to delineate their lack of interchangeability in S&W revolvers.
Colt also developed the 45 ACP in the 1905 model. They used the long colt terminology to keep people from buying the wrong ammo for their semi-autos.

And there you have it; it was originally a description, NOT an official designation. Since both revolvers were popular on the frontier the distinguishing description continued to be used whenever ammunition was purchased. SAA users wanted the 45 Colt rounds. As is the case with most misnomers, the darned term stuck. So much so that some ammunition in 45 Colt caliber is actually marked 45 LC on packaging boxes, and is to this day by several manufacturers. I’ve become indifferent to either term.

But I just don't see the need for continuing to use the obsolete term 45 'LONG' Colt any longer.
There were no original guns even marked as such, certainly not COLT SAAs! I've only seen a few of the modern era SAA clones marked 45 Long Colt.

But again, I don't lose any sleep over it either way.

 

Lots of cartridges have 2 (or more) names. As long as everyone knows the terminology, nothing bad happens.

9mm is probably the king of this. There are dozens of 9mms, but go into any American store selling ammo and ask for 9mm, you'll get 9x19mm aka 9mm Luger aka 9mm Parabellum 100% of the time.

Same with "thirty eight". Ask for "forty five" and, well, you're probably getting .45ACP unless the store is really inquisitive. Ask for ".45 Colt" or ".45 Long Colt" and you'll get the same ammo.

 

The U.S. Army had already purchased the S&W .45, both firearm and ammo, when they adopted the Colt Single Action Army revolver as the U.S. Army's official sidearm. They had discovered that the Colt S.A.A. revolver would chamber and fire cartridges for both revolvers, but the S&W .45 would not chamber or fire the longer Colt .45 cartridge. After the Army dropped the S&W .45, they still had ammunition for the S&W .45 in inventory. It was this circumstance that prompted the ( long Colt .45) reply, when requesting ammunition. It was simply a request for the more powerful Colt .45 cartridge that prompted this misnomer. The correct name for the cartridge has always been Colt .45.

 

The U.S. Army had already purchased the S&W .45, both firearm and ammo, when they adopted the Colt Single Action Army revolver as the U.S. Army's official sidearm....

You've got it backwards. The .45 Schofield didn't exist until 1875. The Colt SA was already in service. Now if you were talking about the U.S. American in .44 you would be right. There has never been a .45 'short' Colt. That would be the .45 Schofield which Colt had nothing to do with. Oh and in the time period, the words 'pistols' and 'revolvers' were used interchangably. I call it the .45 Colt.

 

There's one thing for sure...If you ask for 45 long Colt at the counter, you will receive 45 Colt , not 45acp . Isn't that really all that matters in the long run ?

 

Sorry, I couldn't help myself!

 

Maybe Shakespeare was right?
(What's in a name? That which we call a rose, by any other name would smell as sweet.)

 

The 40 grain loading of the Colt cartridge must have been dropped very early as original boxes dated 1874 indicate 30 grains of powder. With the change to the shorter round the load was further dropped to 28 grains of powder with a 230 grain bullet.

 

C'mon guys!!!! Everybody and their Grandma realizes that the Colt .45 stamped on the barrel of a Colt .45 A.C.P. is simply Colt's way of designating the manufacturer of the firearm, not an official designator for the .45 A.C.P. cartridge. If you ask for .45 A.C.P. ammo and the sales person hands you a box of Colt .45 ammo or vice versa, I would suggest you hand it back and proceed to another ammo store. Also, why would you differentiate between a Government model .45 A.C.P and a M1911 and later M1911A1. M1911 and M1911A1 has always been the official designation for the .45 A.C.P. pistol. By differentiating, you make it sound like they are 2 completely different guns.

 

Also, why would you differentiate between a Government model .45 A.C.P and a M1911 and later M1911A1. M1911 and M1911A1 has always been the official designation for the .45 A.C.P. pistol. By differentiating, you make it sound like they are 2 completely different guns.

They are.

 

The cartridge head stamp should be proof enough...

.

 

Different yet...

 

Tombstone 45LC...

Nice...

What year they from...!?

.

 

I bought them in 2014 when in Tombstone...at Big Iron Shooting Gallery who has them loaded for resale.

 

If somebody says 45 Colt or 45 Long Colt I know what they are talking about. It’s kinda like ‘clip vs magazine’. I know that this has been mentioned before so I guess I am voicing my agreement.

 

Yes. The Clip vs Magazine is another of my beefs. They are two different things. Like calling all handguns 'pistols'.

But back to my original question. Are there any historical documents showing the 45 Colt as being named such. Something I can hold out and say "Look".

 

Welcome! Good question, and the answers were an interesting and educational read! Thanks to all!

 

The definitive answer is on the guns themselves, .45 Colt, no more-no less.

 

So all this and only 1 historical reference to the name? In any case, I call it the 45 Long Colt. In a living language such as English terms change as time goes by. To convey information to others via that living language you need to speak with current definitions in mind. The perfect example is how the term 'gay' has changed its popular usage definition over the last 40 years. When 45 Colt came out in 1873 that was it. Now, with the 1911 so popular I use the term 45 Long Colt to distinguish it from 45 ACP since most of my shooting buddies are into 1911s and you say you just bought a gun in 45 Colt they immediately think 45ACP. And the argument of there not being a 45 Short doesnt make sense. When the 41 Magnum came out there was no 41 Short, Long, or Special, yet it was given the 'magnumized' version of the caliber.

 

When the 41 Magnum came out there was no 41 Short, Long, or Special, yet it was given the 'magnumized' version of the caliber.

Ah, my friend. What about the .41 Colt? I have a fine example of this caliber in a Model 1887... Expensive to shoot at $1.50/ round, though.

 

And yet my Glock30SF is marked .45 Auto in lieu of .45 ACP...

.

 

And yet my Glock30SF is marked .45 Auto in lieu of .45 ACP...

.

What is that a picture of? That's just nasty.
Is that one of those guns made out of plastic?