Looks like the crooks are getting smarter or at least getting hold of better equipment to pull off their scams.

 

Terrible what counterfeiting is doing to the world. I read the other day that when you buy online a smart memory card for your camera you have to be careful of fakes. Yeah they work in the camera, but not for long. When I was in the Navy we could buy a fake Rolex for $20 that looked pretty real and ran for a few months. Making boxes is childs play for China and the other Asian countries that have spent literally hundreds of years faking things (1900s china faked to look like Ming dynasty, etc). When the shooting happened in NJ a day ago, there are already fake "funding for victims" sites popping up.

This is why to me, a Colt box is NEVER worth more than about $50 bucks. Someone wants $300 more for a gun with a box? I move on.... Or maybe I should tell them, "I just want the gun, take off for the price you are valuing the box, and keep it." The Box Counterfeiters are laughing all the way to the bank. Shoot....they even sell them every WEEK legally on Gunbroker and Ebay for $300, to greedy sellers who try to add them to their Colt and increase the farcical box value to $500. It's insane.

 

That is very disturbing, Looks like DM has now figured out the barcode pattern or most likely paid someone to do it for him. Sad thing is you are the only one I’ve ever saw talk about the barcode scanner but we all know he logs many hours here. Hard to tell what’s rolling out of that town now, we all know about the fake boxes, paperwork, sights, grips,,, one can only wonder what’s being brewed up next.

 

Yeah, that really sucks as the label is an obvious fake.

 

Im starting to agree with you (again) azshot. I used to be such a “box man” that at shows, everyone: people walking and people set up, were like well if it don’t have the box, he won’t be interested. It was the truth, I’ve passed some great stuff simply cause I wanted the box, other than the occasional shooter. My buddy used to give me a hard time and say I’d probably throw the gun away and keep the box instead of the other way around. I only wanted a 99.5% gun or better with the original box for my collection. A few exceptions of course with extremely hard to find stuff. Many had said I was the pickiest collector they ever saw. However as “picky” as I was, I know of Two whom wanted the box to be as nice as the gun. The box is where I compromised, had to be original but I’ve gotten some rough boxes (with minty guns) and been satisfied.

I’ll admit this whole box thing, first Winchester’s, now Colts, has really made me start to care less and less for the box. Actually I find myself buying 96-99% guns for theoretical shooters. I say theoretical because I might shoot 10% I plan on. I’d still probably pay maybe a couple hundred to get one in a nice original box but the days of paying 500-1000 more for the same gun in the original box are over for me I think.

 

been a guy selling these guaranteeing they will scan online for a few months now......hate to post where....since i havent seen one in person i would like to know but hate to ask how you identified it as a aftermarket label? (other than being obviously new)

 

The fonts are completely wrong. Sadly there are some so close it it very hard to tell.

 

I've never seen a label so clean. Its cleaner than the 2019 colts I've bought this year.

The scammer should've rubbed it on the concrete a few times.

 

He could scuff it all he wants and it would be still be an obvious fake.

 

One thing is for sure, screenshots of these critiques are a good way for him to help his Chinese suppliers up their game.

 

What has happened in most collecting worlds is when the counterfeits become so prevalent and good that only a few supreme experts can tell, the price of originals plummets. Happens all the time. Eventually buyers suspect EVERYTHING and just stop paying "rare original" prices for "uncertains." Maybe not a true expert, but 99% of the buyers will.

The counterfeiter is profiting while ruining our hobby at the same time. So until somebody does something to stop the selling of fake boxes on ebay and Gunbroker (who also are profiting at the ruination of our hobby), it's not looking good for people that own a lot of Colts "in original boxes."

Why, oh why, the world wants to know, does no one stop the fence that is selling the fraudulent boxes? Gunbroker and Ebay know it's going on, they don't care because they get thousands of dollars in fees every year. They are complicit in the fraud the same as someone that takes counterfeit $20 bills and re-spends them.

 

Since it's Colt's trademark that's presumably being infringed, I'm guessing they're the only ones with legal standing to lean on eBay, Gunbroker et al to get counterfeit merchandise removed (Disclaimer: IANAL). If Colt can't be bothered I'm not sure why eBay, etc should care.

As for the seller in question, I would wager 99% of his customers know exactly what they're getting when they shell out $250+ for one of those "New Old Stock" boxes (which also helps explain his high rating). The people actually getting defrauded in this setup are the (uninitiated) collectors paying $500-$1000 extra for a gun because the listing was "enhanced" with a fake box. But these aren't "fake box man's" actual customers.

 

Barcode printers are as common as barcode readers.
It was only a matter of time before the bleepheads would manage to devalue all the legitimate original packaging materials.
A good solid slap in the moosh may be the only recourse for such things.

 

Agree my friend. Surely there is action that could be taken by Colt for trademark infringements isn’t there ?? Or am I wrong ??

 

If the counterfeiting is occurring in China that is basically standard operation there. If these are being printed in the US and Colt wants to try to stop them they have a chance in my opinion.

 

They are being printed in the U.S. For years collectors have wanted Colt to go after FBM for copyright infringement and yet they do nothing. It boggles the mind.

 

20915493
The boxes however come from China. In bulk I might add.

 

Not making excuses, but making a box and selling and marking it as such for a filler for someone wanting a complete package albeit a put together repro set is not a problem.
What is a problem and I think is illegal is making that box and marketing it as new old stock from Colt, should be a crime and put out of business. READ-Sparta Box Man.
For the life of me, I don't see how he is still doing it with all the exposure of such fraudulent actions.,

 

A good lawyer or DA should connect with Colt and tell them they will prosecute the guy, pro bono, until he has to pay court fees when they win the case. Simple.

 

I tried searching the forum for it but could not find the thread but I remember years ago, there was a lawyer member here pursuing it but never heard if it was successful.
Anybody remember that?

 

I don't know haw many companies whose trademarks BoxMan infringes upon...but a good legal firm could represent them all in suing for infringement. The more companies that take part the better the case would look to a judge.

 

I would not throw the fake box in the dumpster, as I WANT a box, any box but preferably something indicating a Colt and hopefully an original box. If the original box is long gone then a reproduction box, for me, is better than nothing. If I was a dealer and got a fake box in, I would take a sharpie and write somewhere in the corner and on the label something like: (Reproduction box and label). Write it in a few places on the box. That way the buyer knows, but he does get a box, and he then WONT buy a box off the fake box guys.

 

I rethought it some. I think I will pee on it before it goes in the dumpster tomorrow morning.

 

The way I see it...there's a difference between a reproduction box and a counterfeit box. Counterfeit is made specially to deceive for profit. I get the point about marking it as not being genuine but it's simply putting lipstick on a pig.

 

I helped a buddy at a recent gun show evaluate a Diamondback 22LR. The seller said they didn’t know Colts so I was “kind” when I pointed out the box wasn’t even close to original (a handwritten label when it should have been a barcode / computer label) when the seller said he had the box with the serial number. I wonder if he was truly fooled or trying to fool others. Irrespective, we walked since we didn’t want to support this behavior.

 

Colt has zero financial incentive to pursue legal action. 1. They don't make any money on old boxes, whether real or fake. 2. The other parties don't have any money to fork over in a settlement / IP dispute.

Contrast with, say, sports team merchandise. The team/league definitely DOES make money on sales of the real thing so they have a strong incentive to put the counterfeits out of business.

No smart company would even assign a single person (presumably being total comped at ~$60k/yr or more) to hunt down fakes online in this scenario. Or outsource it and still pay five figures a year.

 

Come on now, does anyone really think Gunbroker, E Bay or whoever would have somebody that could absolutely step in and prove that these boxes and such are fake? Are they going to forensically test them? Especially when Colt does not even seem to care. They can't just take a collectors word for it that the boxes are fake. They could become liable themselves if they accused and could not prove. People loose money in stocks, bonds etc., each and every day. Now it seems that the box and accessory end of the hobby has become polluted, if you own lot's of real boxes. Sorry to those that have the real ones. It is what it is.

 

Why would any auction sites prove anything. At most all want from them is history of transactions. Boxes would be easy to prove fake many ways, but the way you are looking at it is from the wrong end of it. You are going to the end product, you would look at the beginning.

 

"Follow the money". This one seller has made over $100,000 last time I looked years ago, selling hundreds of perfect condition Colt boxes for years and years. It's quite obvious they are fake and he has a chinese factory making them for him.

 

^^^ unfortunately I believe the number is more like $600,000.....at least.

 

Having worked for a couple of companies that printed bar codes on their products or packaging, I can tell you that it is an extremely simple matter to print a bar code that matches anything you want as long as you have the correct code from an original example.
The Chinese may be our trading partners but they certainly are not our friends. And their business culture and ethics are very different. Their attitude is it is our fault for making those boxes so easy to copy and they have a couple of billion people to feed so any way to make money is fair game.
If Fake Box Man wasn't so greedy, he could do like a few have suggested and have the boxes clearly marked in an inconspicuous location as reproductions and sell them for under $50. I'll bet he pays about $5 each plus shipping for them.

 

https://www.ftc.gov/faq/consumer-protection/submit-consumer-complaint-ftc