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I have seen many old Colts for sale by this same person (Collecting Texas) on Guns International. I wondered where he was coming up with so many
old SAA's. That explains a lot. Thanks for that information.
He makes a lot of shows and gets a lot of single actions Terry. I've known him for about 32 years now and have bought and sold a many a single action from and to him through the years. He's like the American pickers guys "He will buy anything he thinks he can make a buck on" and he's had a lot of good guns through the years so it works out looks like!
 

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I like old guns, I like guns with character and I like guns with history...that being said I must not be a true enthusiast because I would give a third of that amount for that revolver. Looking at it I instantly think bubba, even though it has a paper trail. Different strokes for different folks I guess
 

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I wonder how Mr. Kopec ascertained that this particular gun was a confirmed Virginia Milita issue? Is there a list somewhere I have overlooked? Maybe a individual search by SRS confirmed the issue.
There are other likely V.M. issued guns that don't have the markings scrubbed off. John Kopec is a TON smarter than me and the gun IS in the correct serial range but how about this hypothesis... stolen, markings ground off, cut, nickeled and ivory. A lot of effort to disguise a stolen gun but who knows...
 

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I wonder how Mr. Kopec ascertained that this particular gun was a confirmed Virginia Milita issue? Is there a list somewhere I have overlooked? Maybe a individual search by SRS confirmed the issue.
There are other likely V.M. issued guns that don't have the markings scrubbed off. John Kopec is a TON smarter than me and the gun IS in the correct serial range but how about this hypothesis... stolen, markings ground off, cut, nickeled and ivory. A lot of effort to disguise a stolen gun but who knows...

I would prefer to see Mr. Kopec restrict himself to the originality of the revolver, i.e. original finish, parts, etc. In reading his letters (and magazine articles) he gets way too much into what regiment a certain gun was issued to, if it was captured by Indians, what dealer sold the gun, etc. And all without any proof, just educated guesses on his part. Note how often he uses the words "I believe, "my theory," and so on. Contrary to what some believe, he's good, but he's not God.

John Gross
 

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Depends on what you collect: unaltered specimens (100 percenters being the ultimate) or historic altered in use specimens. I like both, at least one example of the former as a standard by which to judge the originality of others and the latter specimens showing alterations and wear gained during use for their historic and romantic value.

I like Mr. Kopec's historic information. I feel his knowledge and access to that information is part of what I pay for. It puts the gun in historical context and I'm not sure I could get it otherwise.

I've delt with OC over the years and have never found him rude only a colorful character and long time dealer with the experience and knowledge that goes with that. I've found him honest and reliable although, like most dealers, he likes to get top dollar and is sometimes liberal with his condition estimates.

I've also dealt with Brent over the years. I've found him honest, knowledgeable and meticulous in his merchandise descriptions and his prices are nearly always very reasonable.

Based on my experience the price of the subject Buy Back is on the cheap side if it checks out upon inspection.
 

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I don't know OC well but I have sold him a couple of guns. To his credit, they are more interesting when they reached his website! I have also sought him out at the Tulsa show to get his opinion on something and he was not rude and did give his opinion, which i appreciated and respected. He usually passes my table at Tulsa and acknowledges my presence. I have had no bad experience with him and feel he is "OK". Regards.

Regarding the gun of topic, it is plain to see it is not a Bubba job and is well done with the refinish. Kopec in his "Study" devotes a full chapter (VIII in the US section) on these Virginia guns and how they ended up being sold commercially. I could find no mention of shortening the barrels so don't know if Adams did that at the time of "civilianizing" them or ? I also have read in the past about some 4 13/16" inched barreled SAA's that went to a State Militia but a quick check of a couple of books on hand did not find that information. I sold, a couple of years ago, an 1874 commercial that had the barrel cut and was renickeled with wood for $2500.00. It was a nice looking gun with less nickel on it than the one we discuss. The grips on it were one piece wood. Ivory prices vary, but being conservative and say the ivory grips are a $600 item I can see the gun, as it stands, worth $3000. The other $775 for a $400 letter and PROBABLE militia connection is not unreasonable in my mind. Regards.
 

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The Kopec letter is for a different gun. The seller also states "the letter explains that Virginia sold these guns to a surplus arms dealer who removed all U.S. markings". I do not see that in the letter.
 

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The Kopec letter is for a different gun. The seller also states "the letter explains that Virginia sold these guns to a surplus arms dealer who removed all U.S. markings". I do not see that in the letter.[/QUOTE

First thing I noted on THIS gun ....especially once I noticed the individuals involved.....was the letter is a COPY of a kopec letter......it was what ended up triggering the rudeness from Mr Weisner once I questioned him on the Kopec letter.....be ya'lls own judge here though. I just know what my situation was on the gun I bought and the difference in the new letter I received from Kopec once I sent it back for verification . There were paragraphs missing on the received copied letter I received originally.. To be fair I agree with HWJHFS on OCyoung and he was pleasant with me and the gun was basically revised into the original configuration.... but in my opinion one should NOT doctor up the letters of Mr Kopec to sell them.........I bought the gun from OC but he had acquired it from Weisner so not sure how much OC knew when he sold my gun to me.....but you have to imagine they know each other pretty damn good.
 

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Discussion Starter · #32 ·
Uglydog, I would be very upset if someone 'doctored' such a letter. You had every right to be upset. It is especially bad when a person takes out all of the negative comments that Kopec made and only forwarded the good ones.
 

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Uglydog, I would be very upset if someone 'doctored' such a letter. You had every right to be upset. It is especially bad when a person takes out all of the negative comments that Kopec made and only forwarded the good ones.

That is BS, but remember a copy is just that - a copy. If I'm spending +$5k on a pistol from a dealer it better have a real letter.

I've bought and traded with OC and found him to be very colorful and friendly.
 

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Discussion Starter · #34 ·
That is BS, but remember a copy is just that - a copy. If I'm spending +$5k on a pistol from a dealer it better have a real letter.

I've bought and traded with OC and found him to be very colorful and friendly.
Dalfort, You referenced my post and said, "That is BS..." Was something I stated so wrong as to say it was BS?
 

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I hope so since I don't think I said anything that was out of line.

Sorry for the confusion, I was solely referencing the practice of creating/modifing Colt "official" letters........Perfect example of why I both love and hate the Colt SAA. Being the most iconic Western collectible of her time, she invites all types of skullduggery in her trade : )

Regardless its still a pretty neat old pistol considering the early barrel address and wearing vintage Ivories
 

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Discussion Starter · #38 ·
Dalfort, in reading your other posts, I had assumed that, but was not sure the way you worded the post. I think all collectors are irritated when someone alters a document to make a gun more attractive. I have known a few people over the years who have done that.
 
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