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Are either or both of the Colt Model O 1911 and 1918 classified a C&R based on collectability? If you think yes please provide a citation.
Colt Model O 1911 and 1918
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I do not have a Citation, but, my understanding has been, that anything "fifty years old' or older, is good to go for C & R ( so long as it is not some 'any other weapon' or a sawed off metallic Cartridge Shotgun having barrels less than 18 inches, a selective fire with full auto option, and so on along those lines ).
Thus making all Original run m1911s good to go under the C & R.
Reproduction m1911s, would not be good to go under C & R. since they as individuals are not older than fifty years of age.
Why do you distinguish the "1918" from the "1911 Model O"?
1918 is merely one year among many during which the m1911 was produced. There is no Model of 1918 or 1918 designation.
All circa 1918 Colt .45 Automatics, would be Model "O"s and all Colt .45 Automatics made in 1918 would be ether 'm1911s' or Government Models.
So, in summary, far as I have always known, any Colt .45 Automatic in original configuration and not modified to go full Auto and not having a Smooth Bore Barrel, and not fitted with a 'Silencer'...if it is fifty years old or older, it is qualified under the C & R FFL.
Some 'Commemoratives' less than fifty years old, may also qualify, but, for that, one would have to consult the B of A T F and now also E "List" of individual Arms which are less than fifty years old, to see if the one which one may have in mind will qualify under C & R.
And if not, one can always Petition the B of A T F and now also E, to have them add a 'Commemorative' they had previously overlooked.
Thus making all Original run m1911s good to go under the C & R.
Reproduction m1911s, would not be good to go under C & R. since they as individuals are not older than fifty years of age.
Why do you distinguish the "1918" from the "1911 Model O"?
1918 is merely one year among many during which the m1911 was produced. There is no Model of 1918 or 1918 designation.
All circa 1918 Colt .45 Automatics, would be Model "O"s and all Colt .45 Automatics made in 1918 would be ether 'm1911s' or Government Models.
So, in summary, far as I have always known, any Colt .45 Automatic in original configuration and not modified to go full Auto and not having a Smooth Bore Barrel, and not fitted with a 'Silencer'...if it is fifty years old or older, it is qualified under the C & R FFL.
Some 'Commemoratives' less than fifty years old, may also qualify, but, for that, one would have to consult the B of A T F and now also E "List" of individual Arms which are less than fifty years old, to see if the one which one may have in mind will qualify under C & R.
And if not, one can always Petition the B of A T F and now also E, to have them add a 'Commemorative' they had previously overlooked.
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Hi Mike, I checked the ATF page and while many of the commemorative 1911's are classified as C&R's, I didn't find a reference to these two. FWIW, the ATF's description of a C&R is (excluding machine guns, etc.) firearms manufactured over 50 years ago, it also includes firearms of collectible interest so many Colt Commemoratives SAA's and 1911's are listed, but not these.
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Why do you distinguish the "1918" from the "1911 Model O"?
I am referring to commeratives and that is the correct titles of both. The O1911 is Carbonia Blue, the 01918 is Black Army, these are designations on the white shipping sleeve labels. Sorry for any confusion.
Thanks Doc, that was my take also but I was hoping someone had a reference I missed.
I am referring to commeratives and that is the correct titles of both. The O1911 is Carbonia Blue, the 01918 is Black Army, these are designations on the white shipping sleeve labels. Sorry for any confusion.
Thanks Doc, that was my take also but I was hoping someone had a reference I missed.
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Since they are not 50 years old and not otherwise on the ATF list, not C&R eligible.
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Here is the text straight from the ATF's "Firearms Curios and Relics List"
ATF publication 5300.11
Note Item #1 and #3
ATF publication 5300.11
Note Item #1 and #3
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Sorry Mike! I was not familiar with the reproduction names...
Mike,
I agree with you they qualify per the terms. To get them on the list, someone has to write a letter to the atf, send it in duplicated, and await a response. I feel bad here as I had this idea two years ago or so, actually drafted a letter and collected some aftermarket sales to document the valuation. then I got busy and didn't finish it or send it in...
So, you can't treat them as C&R until the ATF says so, which shouldn't be hard. Consider the 1968/68 vintage WWI commemorative sells for less, and was made in I think four or five times more volume than the O1911 or O1918.
I agree with you they qualify per the terms. To get them on the list, someone has to write a letter to the atf, send it in duplicated, and await a response. I feel bad here as I had this idea two years ago or so, actually drafted a letter and collected some aftermarket sales to document the valuation. then I got busy and didn't finish it or send it in...
So, you can't treat them as C&R until the ATF says so, which shouldn't be hard. Consider the 1968/68 vintage WWI commemorative sells for less, and was made in I think four or five times more volume than the O1911 or O1918.
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