[Ira Paine]

Hi All,
I just joined this Forum as I'm starting to put together a collection of Pre-War Colt DA Target Guns. I'm not new to Gun Collecting but have never collected Colt Revolvers.

What I'm looking for is a listing of serial numbers for the DA Targets and the years they were made + how many different Models may have been made + how many of each Model were made, from about 1900 up to 1945 without buying a $500.00 book as I'm retired and on a limited income. I've been trying to put together a list my self but have haven't had much luck with the info I have on hand.

So far I've come up with about 10 different Models but not much on serial numbers, years made, or how many of each model were made.

Any help would be helpful. Thanks, Ira Paine

 

[bfoster]

Ira Paine,

I wish I could be of more help. If you have a copy of R.L. Wilson's Colt's Dates of Manufacture (1837-1978), an inexpensive paperback, you have the basic tool.

Unfortunately, the target models generally don't have seperate serial ranges, but are mixed in with non target models. E.G., the New Service & Shooting Master share a single numbering sequence. Again, the same is so with the Officers Model & the Officers Model Target.

Study each revolver you get a chance to examine. Unfortunately, there are a growing number of fakes on the market. Knowledge is your best defence. The worst of the situation is that sometimes the seller doesn't know that his offering is a parts gun, not a target model.

Bob

 

[Ira Paine]

Thanks Bob,
I kind of thought it was that way, of coures I was hopeing it wasn't. I was hoping that by this time someone would have it broken down like the SAA. I didn't think they were worth fakeing like some of the others. I have the R.L Wison book and it is of some help but doesn't have everything I'm looking for. I was hopeing someone had done a study of them that I could check out befoure I start spending money I don't have. Again thanks for your reply, maybe I'll stay with S&W's

IP

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by bfoster:
Ira Paine,

I wish I could be of more help. If you have a copy of R.L. Wilson's Colt's Dates of Manufacture (1837-1978), an inexpensive paperback, you have the basic tool.

Unfortunately, the target models generally don't have seperate serial ranges, but are mixed in with non target models. E.G., the New Service & Shooting Master share a single numbering sequence. Again, the same is so with the Officers Model & the Officers Model Target.

Study each revolver you get a chance to examine. Unfortunately, there are a growing number of fakes on the market. Knowledge is your best defence. The worst of the situation is that sometimes the seller doesn't know that his offering is a parts gun, not a target model.

Bob<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

[bfoster]

Ira Paine,

The last thing I wanted to do was to discourage you. One book, Haven & Belden's History of the Colt Revolver, 1940, was reprinted in 1978 by Bonanza. The reprint is reasonably priced (as books go these days). It has over 100 pages of pictures of old Colt revolvers & automatics dating from the time period in which you indicate an interest.

The fakes are mostly confined to the high end of the market. There are simply too many fine old Colt target revolvers out there to make it worth the effort to duplicate, say an Officers Model Target (Heavy Barrel) in 38 Special. The same revolver, in 32 Colt New Police, is a different story (850 made). Kind of like the situation with K32's. You'd be careful there, wouldn't you?

regards,

Bob

 

[Ira Paine]

Thanks again Bob,

As I've said Gun Collecting is not new to me, had one of the larger Colt 1911 collections in the country, been at it for about 40 years so I'm not easely discouraged.

One of the reasons I'm starting the Colt Pre-War DA Target Collection is because I'm about at the end of my S&W collection, have just about all of the Pre-War Target S&W's so thought I would do some Colts.

I'll search for the book you memtioned and if it has much of anything that I'm looking for I'll buy it.

I think this will only be a small collection if there is only about 10 different Models.

I only have two at this time, a OMT heavy barrel in 38 Spl. and a OMT in 32 S&W Long, you have just given me some info on the OMT in 32 that I did not know, only 850 made, this is the type of info that I'm looking for
as it helps me judge the rarety and tells me why I'm paying big $$$$$ or small $$$ for an item, of course I know condition is also inportant and has a lot to do with priceing of any item. I do have a lot of books but most don't have much on the Colt DA's. Thanks for the tip on the number made of OMT in 32, did you find it in print or was it in a factory letter ?. I don't even want to think about getting factory letters on any Colts as the cost is way out of line for me, I would have to go back to work just to aford them and would sooner spend what money I have for this collection on Guns

IP

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by bfoster:
Ira Paine,

The last thing I wanted to do was to discourage you. One book, Haven & Belden's History of the Colt Revolver, 1940, was reprinted in 1978 by Bonanza. The reprint is reasonably priced (as books go these days). It has over 100 pages of pictures of old Colt revolvers & automatics dating from the time period in which you indicate an interest.

The fakes are mostly confined to the high end of the market. There are simply too many fine old Colt target revolvers out there to make it worth the effort to duplicate, say an Officers Model Target (Heavy Barrel) in 38 Special. The same revolver, in 32 Colt New Police, is a different story (850 made). Kind of like the situation with K32's. You'd be careful there, wouldn't you?

regards,

Bob<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

[bfoster]

Ira Paine,

With a "handle" like Ira Paine, a man should have a deep interest in S&W.

Here is the source for my figure of 850 Colt OMT 32's. O'Meara I dropped "Doc" O'Meara an e-mail this A.M. asking for more information.

Here is a pic of this beauty:

As for prices, Supica's website is as good a barometer as any if you refuse to pay inflated prices. The worst of it is that he isn't really a Colt specialist (though many thanks are due to him for his work for S&W collectors).

Supica

Here is a website with some (good?) information and staggering prices.

Wimer's

Some of the items they list for sale have been there a l-o-n-g time!

The Haven & Belden book's illustrations consist mainly of reproductions of catalog information, with a number of pictures taken inside the Colt plant prior to WWII. Unfortunately, the main interest shown in the book is not DA revolvers. You'll find the scholarship regarding the SAA therein a bit "quaint". Not much solid to chew on. Have you a better reference than this?

If you'd like, I'll try to come up with a list, and the s/n ranges wherein these may be found. Counting more than minor variations (mechanical), and chambering, there were considerably more than 10 different target models offered in the period 1900-1945.

As an advanced S&W collector, perhaps you can point me toward some information I'd like to have. Is there a monograph dealing with S&W stocks? Jinks & Supica's books picture many revolvers with "wrong" stocks.

thanks,

Bob

[This message has been edited by bfoster (edited 02-27-2002).]

 

[Ira Paine]

WOW, I think I understand why this BB is not used much, sometimes it takes me over 5 min.'s to load a page.

Thanks again Bob for the link to the 32 info. I know Jim, Rick, and Roy Jinks very well as I've been a member of the S&W Collectors Association for over 30 years.
I also run the SWCA internet group for them.

I know what you mean about the pictures in some of the books, Jim tried to make corrections in his second edition.

S&W's I know, Colt Auto's I know, but the only thing I know about Colt Revolvers is to stay away from SA's because of the all the fakes.

I checked the listings in the Blue Book and they list about 9 different Models of DA Targets including the Camp Perry Model as follows:

1-Officers Model Target, First, Second, and Third Issue.

2-New Service Target.

3-Shooting Master Target.

4-New Police Target.

5-Police Positive Target, First and Second.

6-Camp Perry Single Shot.

Do you know if I missed any ?.

I guess that's 9 of them, of course I'm not counting all the Minor Variations, I've been that root with the S&W's and the Colt Autos and there more of a nuisance to me than anything else, most cant tell the difference without taking the gun apart or knowing what serial number range there in and if they don't look different on the "outside" no one seems to care.

I'm not counting all the various calibers or the different barrel lengths, just the basic Models, maybe if I become "advanced" in this field I'll pick up a few of the "odd" ones.

I do appreciate all your help and anything you can find out for me. I'm going to try an do a serial number list for each Model that I can understand in a day or two.

I tought for sure that there would be more action on this BB because most Colts seem to be a highly collected gun and it's hard to believe that it was started 9/2000 and only has 155 members ?. I don't know when I'll get back on this BB as it just takes to long for the pages to load, and I don't want to waste that kind of time doing nothing but looking at a blank screen. Maybe that's why it hasn't grown like some of the other BB's I'm sure there are more than 155 Colt collectors out there. IP


<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by bfoster:
Ira Paine,

With a "handle" like Ira Paine, a man should have a deep interest in S&W.

Here is the source for my figure of 850 Colt OMT 32's. O'Meara I dropped "Doc" O'Meara an e-mail this A.M. asking for more information.

Here is a pic of this beauty:

As for prices, Supica's website is as good a barometer as any if you refuse to pay inflated prices. The worst of it is that he isn't really a Colt specialist (though many thanks are due to him for his work for S&W collectors).

Supica

Here is a website with some (good?) information and staggering prices.

Wimer's

Some of the items they list for sale have been there a l-o-n-g time!

The Haven & Belden book's illustrations consist mainly of reproductions of catalog information, with a number of pictures taken inside the Colt plant prior to WWII. Unfortunately, the main interest shown in the book is not DA revolvers. You'll find the scholarship regarding the SAA therein a bit "quaint". Not much solid to chew on. Have you a better reference than this?

If you'd like, I'll try to come up with a list, and the s/n ranges wherein these may be found. Counting more than minor variations (mechanical), and chambering, there were considerably more than 10 different target models offered in the period 1900-1945.

As an advanced S&W collector, perhaps you can point me toward some information I'd like to have. Is there a monograph dealing with S&W stocks? Jinks & Supica's books picture many revolvers with "wrong" stocks.

thanks,

Bob

[This message has been edited by bfoster (edited 02-27-2002).]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>