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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Last week I sent this letter to my local newspaper, the Wyoming AG's office, and Safeway headquarters because I do most of my shopping at Safeway.

"As a legal and trained firearms owner in the state of Wyoming I sometimes carry a firearm, a handgun, openly or concealed for personal protection; which in Wyoming is completely legal and a fairly common practice.
With the increase of shootings at retail outlets such as malls, grocery and convenience stores, fast food restaurants, etc., I am now considering carrying a firearm wherever and whenever I happen to be shopping.
As a law abiding citizen I will follow and don't intend to protest against any business that has a "no firearms" policy as long as this information is clearly and openly posted at the entrances to their business but I believe the responsibility for making customers aware of any and all of a business's policies is entirely incumbent upon the business.
So if the business isn't already covered by Wyoming's no firearms laws such as schools, State, and Federal buildings, and I don't see a "No Firearms" notice at the door I believe I have the legal right to carry a firearm and will do so."

The newspaper informed me that they're going to print it in the "Letters to the Editor" section, no response yet from Safeway, and I got this reply from the Wyoming Division of Criminal Investigation Concealed Firearms Permit Unit.
"The business must clearly state at the entrances of the store that they have a no firearms policy. Some businesses will post this on the inside instead of the entrance so if nothing is stated either outside or inside the business then you will not be breaking any law."

I'm in Wyoming so the laws and policies may be different where you are but I thought the folks here might find this information interesting.
BTW: Among the policies listed at the Safeway headquarters's site is one that states that Safeway has a blanket "no firearms allowed" policy but this is not posted at the store where I shop.
Ride Safe. Dr.Tramp...........
 

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Florida law is similar, a NO Firearms Allowed sign must be posted.
or just carry concealed.
 

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It has also been said "Better to be judged by twelve than carried by six". You can make payments on the costs of the first, but your heirs make the payments on the second.
 

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The law is the same here in MN. A sign must be posted outside and to be enforceable the sign must conform EXACTLY to that described in the law.....word for word....no free lance editorializing in the sign. I believe in MN if a store has the proper signage and a concealed-carry holder is caught with a firearm, the store can ask him/her to leave and, if he/she does, there are no legal issues. You're not subject to arrest simply for being caught with a firearm in a store with the proper signage. They have to give you a chance to exit on request.
 

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The business must clearly state at the entrances of the store that they have a no firearms policy. Some businesses will post this on the inside instead of the entrance so if nothing is stated either outside or inside the business then you will not be breaking any law."
This reply is sort of contradictive in my opinion. The first statement says they must post at the entrance. But then it says some people post on the inside. Which implies that the business is not following the statute. And then the contradicting statement also says that if it’s not posted on the inside or out you are not breaking the law.
So is it enforceable if they are not posting on the outside? It appears that they will let them do it anyway even though they said they must post on the entrance.
 

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Last week I sent this letter to my local newspaper, the Wyoming AG's office, and Safeway headquarters because I do most of my shopping at Safeway.
Okay, I have to ask. I wouldn't ask if I weren't genuinely curious, okay? I'll try to be brief, so I won't quote your entire post.

What was the point of your writing a letter like this and providing copies to your local news outlet(s) and Wyoming's attorney general? What are you wanting to accomplish?

Will you send similarly worded letters to other retail outlets where you do business...like maybe gas stations, convenience stores, car dealers, auto repair shops, etc., etc.? If not, why not? Have you had any sort of problems or confrontations with Safeway employees or management regarding your carrying a gun in their stores?

I looked at the Safeway corporate website, but I don't have the patience to wade through all that rigamarole searching for their firearms policy or policies, since Safeway is just one of a bunch of companies under the Albertsons Companies corporate umbrella. Do you have a direct link to the part of their website that clearly states their policies? If so, will you post it here? Thanks.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
I don't open carry when I'm shopping at Safeway and even if I did a manager would probably just inform me of the company's official policy and ask me to leave. I just wanted to see if this would trigger Safeway into posting their firearms policy as they're legally obligated to.
Here is a link to Albertsons site where they state their firearms policy: Position Statements
Places that serve alcohol are kind of grey areas in Wyoming. You can legally conceal carry in a restaurant where the majority of business is food but alcohol is also served but not in a bar where the majority of business is serving alcohol unless you're a non drinking body guard or designated driver and whoa unto anybody that uses a firearm when or after they've been drinking even if they're legally defending themselves. Personally I've always considered firearms in a drinking environment to be a bad idea.
Sending the letter to the newspaper was to remind people that it's not illegal nor unusual to carry in Wyoming. Since the majority of news media outlets seem to be anti firearm about the only time you hear of or see any coverage of legal firearm owners is when they're represented by people dressed in body armor stomping around waving firearms and ranting.
This ain't me but in the minds of many none firearm owning people this what they picture when they think of firearm owners in general so they need to be made aware that regular everyday folks also own and carry firearms and do so in a quiet and completely law abiding manner.
Ride Safe. Dr.Tramp...............
 

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Silly thread, I don’t know what city your in but I can guess one of three with Safeway stores. Bigger problems exist here than a letter to the AG or corporate entities. You write any letters about the fourteen year old girl arrested in Laramie for not wearing a stupid ineffective mask ? Any letters to the AG on encouraging them to step up to the vaccine mandate ? These are more pressing concerns in Wyoming,not you picking a fight where none exist.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Silly thread, I don’t know what city your in but I can guess one of three with Safeway stores. Bigger problems exist here than a letter to the AG or corporate entities. You write any letters about the fourteen year old girl arrested in Laramie for not wearing a stupid ineffective mask ? Any letters to the AG on encouraging them to step up to the vaccine mandate ? These are more pressing concerns in Wyoming,not you picking a fight where none exist.
You're entitled to your opinion just as is everybody else but what actions if any have you taken in regards to the items you mentioned?
Ride Safe. Dr.Tramp............
 

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How does the law view carrying a firearm somewhere that is "prohibited" but not actually state/federally illegal? Obviously, the business has the right to make those rules on their property and to eject you from the premises, but in the event you carried anyway and had to use your firearm (lawfully), would the law take into consideration you violated store policy?
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
How does the law view carrying a firearm somewhere that is "prohibited" but not actually state/federally illegal? Obviously, the business has the right to make those rules on their property and to eject you from the premises, but in the event you carried anyway and had to use your firearm (lawfully), would the law take into consideration you violated store policy?
This was recently addressed at a shooting at a mall in Nebraska. A father who had a concealed carry permit was carrying his handgun in a mall where firearms are prohibited when a shooting between some teenagers began.
The father wasn't directly involved but pulled his handgun and stood guard outside of a bathroom where his family and others had taken shelter until the police arrived.
The police declined to charge him with anything. I'm not sure what, if anything, the mall management did.
Ride Safe. Dr.Tramp................
 

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In CO the signs themselves hold no legal weight but the business owner can ask you to leave on the basis of ignoring the sign and it's trespassing if you don't.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I don’t pay attention to “no firearms allowed” signs unless it violates state law. All they can do is trespass me and that lets me know where I don’t have to spend my money.
Even if it's not the law I still pay attention to such signs out of respect for the rights of the business.
If I owned a business I'm sure there would be things I would or would not allow based on my personal opinions and beliefs and as long as these weren't breaking any real laws I would expect people to respect and observe my rules or go elsewhere.
Admittedly I break the "no firearms" rule by carrying concealed but I don't do this to make a political statement or to "get away" with something but for self protection.
Ride Safe. Dr.Tramp................
 

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Even if it's not the law I still pay attention to such signs out of respect for the rights of the business.
If I owned a business I'm sure there would be things I would or would not allow based on my personal opinions and beliefs and as long as these weren't breaking any real laws I would expect people to respect and observe my rules or go elsewhere.
Admittedly I break the "no firearms" rule by carrying concealed but I don't do this to make a political statement or to "get away" with something but for self protection.
Ride Safe. Dr.Tramp................
I agree. I always carry and will avoid going into businesses who don't want my business as a gun carrier. My political beliefs revolve around the Constitution but even more importantly: private property rights. My rights end when I try to come into your property and if I don't like it, I'm free to go elsewhere.
 

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Thanks to the OP for the link to Safeway's written policy, vague as it is. Looks like the place is just asking folks not to open carry on premises. Yawn. They don't mention concealed carry, licensed or otherwise, which would seem to solve this more or less nonexistent "problem".

This whole mole hill about "No Guns Allowed" signs in stores, or their no-guns policies has been turned into a mountain thousands of times on every single gun forum I've ever looked at. I can't think of anything new to say about it. I can't even pretend that it seems relevant to me any more, especially when compared to things that genuinely affect my (our) very existence on this planet.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I agree. I always carry and will avoid going into businesses who don't want my business as a gun carrier. My political beliefs revolve around the Constitution but even more importantly: private property rights. My rights end when I try to come into your property and if I don't like it, I'm free to go elsewhere.
Exactly. How can I demand or expect businesses and people to respect my rights if I don't do the same toward theirs?
Ride Safe. Dr.Tramp..........
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 · (Edited)
Thanks to the OP for the link to Safeway's written policy, vague as it is. Looks like the place is just asking folks not to open carry on premises. Yawn. They don't mention concealed carry, licensed or otherwise, which would seem to solve this more or less nonexistent "problem".

This whole mole hill about "No Guns Allowed" signs in stores, or their no-guns policies has been turned into a mountain thousands of times on every single gun forum I've ever looked at. I can't think of anything new to say about it. I can't even pretend that it seems relevant to me any more, especially when compared to things that genuinely affect my (our) very existence on this planet.
I agree that the policy is vague and no doubt purposely so in order not to offend any particular group of customers. I think an additional intent is to allow some leeway to individual store managers based on where they're located.
No doubt places like DC, Chicago, LA and similar high crime areas enforce the policy rigidly whereas here in Wyoming I'd more likely get a polite request to leave or put my firearm in my vehicle and then continue shopping.
I also agree that there are far more important things to be concerned about and believe that the focus given to relatively inconsequential items by the media and government officials is a deliberate effort to distract people from those important things.
Not that it seems to take much to distract most folks these days. :cool:
Ride Safe. Dr.Tramp...............
 

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Exactly. How can I demand or expect businesses and people to respect my rights if I don't do the same toward theirs?
Ride Safe. Dr.Tramp..........
They posted this at my local grocery store for a few days. They finally figured that some punctuation was needed. I think it was employee posted. It disappeared after a few days.
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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
They posted this at my local grocery store for a few days. They finally figured that some punctuation was needed. I think it was employee posted. It disappeared after a few days. View attachment 757133
🤣 I wonder if it was done intentionally to mock the store's policy or was an honest mistake by somebody with a very poor command of the English language.
Ride Safe. Dr.Tramp..............
 
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