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Bought 6" nickel Python on gun broker; stated 99%, fired very little

Well finish on gun is dull around the barrel, dull on the frame near the barrel, pock marked on the right side behind cylinder, grips dinged on the bottom.

Private owner guy says: well for 34 year old gun its pretty nice, and opinion is subjective. your gun, enjoy.

I say: could take this to 10 or 100 people and NO ONE would rate this as 99%. doesn't matter if week old or 100 years old, 99% is 99%

He has left me feedback already. Do i grin and bare it or do i slam him on feedback.

Should point out i have sold on ebay for 15 years and have perfect feedback and told often that i underdescribe. Am i too picky?
 

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Descriptions of 99% aren't or shouldn't be rocket science. A 99% weapon should be "AS new" without any blemishes except perhaps a wee bit of carbon residue around the forcing cone. A revolver that has the pock marks and stock dents should be a 95% condtion, perhaps. The dull finished area can be Flitz'd and that issue is resolved but dings, dents, and dangs don't add up to a 99% anything, IMHO. If you're going to be honest on the feedback state that "item had more wear than described" and leave it at that. My .02 worth.
 

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I noticed the comment about it being a 34 year old gun. 99% is 99% whether it's a gun made last week or 150 years ago in my opinion. I get a lot of "it's in mint shape for a 125 year old gun" when people are talking about single actions. I ask "is this what it looked like when it left the factory?" Most of the time you get a strange look.

To me a 99% gun is as factory new. Even guns that have never been fired but handled even with their boxes might be considered as 99%.

Shame on the seller in this case, but the majority of gun folks are overly optimistic in their judgement of percentages of finish and originality.
 

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A 99% gun is as factory new, generally unfired with the box and all original paperwork. Generally, 99% are safe queens, handling and cycling the action will quickly drop a gun to 95% by leaving marks and turn lines. I bought a S&W 65 off GB described as new without box, turned out to be well used, rusty and out of time!!
best!
geichal
 

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To me, a 99% gun does have a tiny bit of finish wear on the high edges of the muzzle, and maybe a hint on the cylinder high edges. It is not just a 100% gun that is dirty. I would describe such a gun as "As new, except for powder residue," not "99%." Of course, if I were selling such a gun, I would clean it of all powder residue and describe it "Fired, but as new, with no finish wear."

When a seller's description is misleading or inaccurate, that SHOULD be mentioned in the feedback. The feedback area is character-limited so it is hard to be descriptive in such a small space, but try. Compose it in "Word" and work on it within the known character limit to be as descriptive as possible in the space available. Start with something like: "Seller says 99%, but gun has many dings and significant finish damage. ...... Seller refuses to adjust for misleading description." You decide what letter grade to give. I do not think the problems described are merely a difference of opinion between, say, 95% and 93%, etc. The description is very inaccurate. Most likely, you would not have bought the gun if it had been accurately described. I might consider a grade of "F" under the circumstances.
 

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When I rate a gun 99% it will look like new but show evidence of being fired somewhat more than at the factory. No high edge wear, no blems. But everyone rates different. I sold over 1800 collector grade out of production guns last year and had 6 returns. Your doing the new buyer and yourself a favor when grade a gun critical.

Under promise and over deliver, key to success.

John Fugate
 

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John - I bought one from you early this year and I could not be happier. I agree the key to success is to under promise and over deliver. You do it right!
 

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Ken,
I looked up the ad and see the pictures are not very good and hard to judge condition. Nickel is hard to photograph and the finish itself shows any and all imperfections. I know you are very picky, which is a good thing when buying collectable guns but grading is very subjective. If you can't work out a resonable solution with the seller I would give him neutral feedback as although the condition was not what you expected it was not too out of line pricing for a nickel Python with original box. Just my opinion and i would probably feel just like you in this instance
 

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Agreed with everyone's posts here. Condition is not dependent on age; I am sick of hearing the same things as all of you (it's in GREAT shape for being XX years old!).
 

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Bottom line is if there was no inspection period and you didn't pay with CC you are now the owner of that gun. Get some Flitz on the finish and it may look a lot better. I agree about leaving neutral feedback. Good luck.
 

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Also been knicked

I too bought a gun advertised as flawless and in perfect condition. Asked if there was an inspection period before I bid, and was told by seller that he didn't offer one, as his gun was perfect and he didn't want it returned after an inspection with some kind of damage. I bought it, found a small scrape or abrasion on the frame. When I went back to the seller, he said it was perfect when he shipped it, I got a beautiful gun at a good price, and it was now mine. Wouldn't answer my calls or emails after that. I left him poor feedback, and of course, he did the same to me. At least I had the satisfaction of outing him and warning people to insist on an inspection period. Don't let these sellers get away with their over-generous descriptions. Give them the feedback they deserve.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
thanks to all

some well thought out suggestions. seller is unresponsive to any adjustment at all. Feedback seems to be my route.
 

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Live and learn and we all hope that the lesson tution isn't too expensive as we "go to school". Your comment may well save someone else from this seller's ignorance on grading condition later.
 

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In my opinion if they say 99%, it better be AT LEAST 90%.This putz deserves to be slammed.I recently had someone misrepresent condition. They reluctantly took the gun back and refunded my money with a letter saying they had three collector's swear this pitted, refinished hard chrome python was original e nickel.I haven't left a feedback yet.
 

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This is one thing I have done alot of reading on because I am so particular on condition (but appparently not as some in this thread lol). If you look at all price guides and gun books that give a description of how to grade condition, then most say that a new gun has to be factory test fired only. However some of the time there is a "premium" listed for a NIB gun over the 100% condition, so they could be considered 2 different grades. But then again a gun could be "NIB, new old stock" and not been stored properly and not be 100% condition, but that would affect price of course since it would have finish problems. A gun can be fired and be Mint or 100%, but if fired more than a few times, it will usually start to show some wear. Everybody sees condition differently so I give 1% or so on guns I buy. If it is advertised as 99% and I get a solid 98% gun then I let it go. If I am suppose to be getting a "NIB, Mint/Pristine/Perfect Gun" and I get a 98%-99% gun then I have issues. I pay extra (as do others) to get these guns. I rate a 99% gun as one with a light turn line (into the finish faintly because even alot new guns have a faint touch line) and a couple of small light handling marks/imperfections OR a light turn line faintly into the finish and a tad bit of edge wear that is so light it can barely be seen and no handling marks-this last would be hard to find but I have saw a few like this. I will add that I have owned many Factory NIB guns, the best of the best, and I have only had a very VERY few that would classify as "Perfect condition" guns. If you get even the best examples under bright light, most of the time you can find a light handling mark somewhere on the gun or stocks.
If I got the gun the OP got, from the way it sounds, I would be upset. I would first talk to the seller and see if he would take it back, then if he didnt want to/wouldnt, I would see about getting a small refund on the purchase price. I would give the seller a chance to make it right before I would blow him up on feedback. If he refused to do anything or got hateful over HIS MISTAKE, then I would put it to him on the feedback. JMHO.
 

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I'm more along the lines of Big Gus in my evaluation of a gun and also pricing it. basically going by the Blue Book rating. Not slamming as I have been victim as much if not more, but I have learned the lesson with the lumps and bruises... pics , pics , pics !! If they are bad photos then let it go. Every time I got the stinky end of the stick, when I went back and looked, there was a reason that particular photo was blurry, or over flashed, etc. To be honest, I have always let the seller slide in those cases and if it was a true mis-representation of the truth on the sellers part, I don't do business again with them. One should be able to put stock into a rating of NIB... 100%.. or 99%.. but I now like the photos to prove it is as the seller says. Here's the main thing: no matter how the seller and the buyer rate the gun, was the price paid along the lines of what the gun is worth?. If I was pretty close then I'm okay. Like previously stated, an unfired, unturned, NIB can rust or wood crack, etc and be much less. I am picky and have been disappointed by gun shop purchases on new guns sometimes too. As we speak I'm gonna have to take a brand new SA apart and send the trigger guard in to be refinished from a factory flaw. (NOT A COLT). I had the gun for weeks before I even noticed, but when I did I couldn't believe I had not seen it. You just don't expect to have a fresh from the factory gun have problems. The good news is there are many honest people out there and some that really under-rate as well. I've had a few good surprises too. I guess my rambling point is that nobody should feel the only one if burned on a GBroker deal. If you buy enough of them there is almost no way to not get stuck if that was the sellers intention.
 

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Just curious, can you post a link to the auction. I would like to see how it was described. That is the trouble with grading a firearm with numbers. If it had an inspection period for return regardless of the reason, then you have/had a right to return, if not, then there is not much recourse. It doesn't sound like it is terribly blemished. Ron
 

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I agree that no gun is perfect. It may be 100% NIB but under florescent lights or magnification you can always find polishing marks or some other tiny imperfection. Granted I have not seen nearly as many examples of many members but that is my observation. Unless you buy online from an established dealer, like several on our forum, you are taking a risk buying something you don't see in person. % estimates are only as good as the seller
 

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This is one thing I have done alot of reading on because I am so particular on condition (but appparently not as some in this thread lol). If you look at all price guides and gun books that give a description of how to grade condition, then most say that a new gun has to be factory test fired only. However some of the time there is a "premium" listed for a NIB gun over the 100% condition, so they could be considered 2 different grades. But then again a gun could be "NIB, new old stock" and not been stored properly and not be 100% condition, but that would affect price of course since it would have finish problems. A gun can be fired and be Mint or 100%, but if fired more than a few times, it will usually start to show some wear. Everybody sees condition differently so I give 1% or so on guns I buy. If it is advertised as 99% and I get a solid 98% gun then I let it go. If I am suppose to be getting a "NIB, Mint/Pristine/Perfect Gun" and I get a 98%-99% gun then I have issues. I pay extra (as do others) to get these guns. I rate a 99% gun as one with a light turn line (into the finish faintly because even alot new guns have a faint touch line) and a couple of small light handling marks/imperfections OR a light turn line faintly into the finish and a tad bit of edge wear that is so light it can barely be seen and no handling marks-this last would be hard to find but I have saw a few like this. I will add that I have owned many Factory NIB guns, the best of the best, and I have only had a very VERY few that would classify as "Perfect condition" guns. If you get even the best examples under bright light, most of the time you can find a light handling mark somewhere on the gun or stocks.
If I got the gun the OP got, from the way it sounds, I would be upset. I would first talk to the seller and see if he would take it back, then if he didnt want to/wouldnt, I would see about getting a small refund on the purchase price. I would give the seller a chance to make it right before I would blow him up on feedback. If he refused to do anything or got hateful over HIS MISTAKE, then I would put it to him on the feedback. JMHO.
Josh, he just wanted an opinion of a 99% gun not a thesis term paper LOL :D
 
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