[rcwambold]

Just couldn't let this pass ... ColtCollector1911 and WS23 brought it up ... Which, of the several Wyatt Earps do YOU like best and why? CC1911 really likes the Russel Earp. I prefer the Costner Earp. Better still, I prefer the James Garner Earp but the movie itself is inferior to either of the newer ones, I think. There's a Jimmie Stewart Earp, Burt Lancaster, Garner, Costner and Russel. And Hugh O'Brian, too. Best possible, I think if Lancaster could've played in the Costner version instead of Costner! (Just too old by then ... maybe too dead.) He was GOOD! Just the version he was in, in his day, hadn't got punch the best of the new ones have. Too steretyped, I guess.

 

[dfariswheel]

You forgot a couple.
There was the 1971 movie "Doc" starring
Stacy Keach .... Doc Holliday
Faye Dunaway .... Katie Elder
Harris Yulin .... Wyatt Earp

Then there was the classic John Ford version starring Henry Fonda, "My Darling Clementine".

"Doc" was a little stinker, one of those Vietnam era "deconstruction" movies that went to great efforts to make traditional hero's into evil bums.

Somewhat in the same "tradition" as "Little Big Man", and others that re-made any American hero into a crazed power-mad freak.

In "Little Big Man" General Custer was re-made into a psychotic, babbling nut case.

In "Doc", Wyatt Earp is supposed to be an early version of.....Richard Nixon.
The entire Gunfight at the OK Corral is actually a sleazy political maneuver by the Earp's.

As for the others:
The Burt Lancaster version was a typical Hollywood Super-hero movie, saved and made a legend by Kirk Douglas's smoldering Doc Holiday.

Henry Fonda's "My darling Clementine" was another Hollywood fable, especially considering that John Ford knew Wyatt Earp in his Hollywood days, and had talked to him about the gunfight to insure "accuracy".
Still, it's a movie classic.

The Jimmy Stewart version, "Cheyenne Autumn"
was thrown in by John Ford, because he thought the movie was getting too serious.
A hilarious spoof, again a classic.

The James Garner versions were, again "deconstruction" movies, fitting nicely with Garner's political views, in which Earp is nothing more than an amoral killer.

The TV version with Hugh O'Brian is typical TV Super hero, no historical accuracy in any way.

The Russel version suffered from low production values. Had they spent a little more money on better actors and scripting it COULD have been the best of them all.
Val Kilmer's Doc, rivals the legendary job done by Kirk Douglas.

The Costner version was, as usual for him, an enormous, flatulent, gasbag of a movie.
WAAAAYYYY to long, with poor scripting.
Dennis Quaid's Doc could have made a bigger splash, except Val Kilmer's version was too fresh.
Unremembered, is Quaid's horrific diet to enable him to look the part of a cadaverous consumptive alcoholic.

There were also several Earp's from the early days of Hollywood, both silent, and 1930's versions.
In one version, a VERY young, SKINNY??? Andy Devine has a roll as a young cowboy.

Now, I'll go you one better:
BEST MOVIE GUNFIGHTER.

My pick: Jack Palance as "Wilson" in the movie "Shane", probably the best Western of all time.

In the book, known by the even more sinister name "Stark Wilson", Palance turned in the grand all time version of what a real gunfighter probably look like.

Somewhere in my library there's a Charlie Russell pen and ink drawing of a real Montana gunman shooting a man in a corral.
The figure in the drawing is dressed just like Palance in the movie.

Palance's cadaverous "Wilson" is no over the top, foaming Evil incarnate. He's just a very quiet professional doing his job.

Probably the most shocking movie shooting ever, (including todays blood spattered, choreographed, extravaganzas) the killing of Torrie the sodbuster, tops them all.
There's no glamor, no "OHHH, I'm hit", no flying through windows, and no smirking.

There's just a muddy street, lost in the vast backdrop wilderness of the mountains.
There's nothing "cool" or music-video about it. It's a killing, pure and simple.

Particularly chilling is Palance's easy, strutting walk up on the sidewalk, while the sodbuster slogs through the muddy street.

Then the coldblooded, and VERY quiet passage of words between Wilson and Torrie.
"Yep, Ol' Stonewall, Lee and the rest of them Rebs was trash, all trash........you too".

Nobody ever did it better the Palance, and nobody likely ever will.

[This message has been edited by dfariswheel (edited 01-12-2004).]

 

[rcwambold]

Holy Cats, dfarris! I wish we could get together and, "quench our thirst," and watch old movies together for an rainy, Sunday afternoon or three! Who the blazes is Harris Yulin? Faye Dunaway can be my huckleberry, anytime. And I think Keach is always good, too. (Great Mike Hammer, don't you think?) But that's a Wyatt I've never heard of. The Cheyenne Autumn I got a kick out of, too. )Liked the touch of Doc smoking a pipe! (I'm an old pipe-sucker and I always like to see other people so afflicted!) My vote for Bad Guy-o El Supremo's gotta' be Lee Marvin in, "The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance." Now that I think about it, his and Palance's characters are quite similar, seems to me. Yes? No? I've thought somebody would make a re-do of it, somewhere along the line. Kevin Costner in, "The Duke's," part? Naw, ... guess not. I'm trying to think of westerns and all I can envision is John Wayne doing a walk-on on Laugh-In; "The sky is blue, the grass is green. Get off your butt and join the Marines."

 

[WS23]

I also like the Tombstone Wyatt Earp movie the best. Part of the reason is the supporting cast. When it comes to rough & tumble cowboy roles, is there anyone better than Sam Elliott (who plays Virgil Earp)? With his deep voice, large mustache, & that squint eye look, he is a cowboy actor extraordinaire. When he speaks it just commands respect.

rcwambold, nice pick up on my short quote from the Tombstone movie in the other post. You must be pretty familiar with the movie yourself! I wasn't sure any one picked up on it as being from the movie. I was beginning to think I picked a line too obscure to be associated with the movie.

The other line I love is "Come on boys, we don't want no trouble in here, not in any language." (Not sure if that is the exact quote, but you know which one I'm talking about.)

 

[rcwambold]

WS23, No doubt about it, it's a great movie, too. I think my favorite scene in it is when Wyatt opens the drawer and gets his, "Buntline." And that, alas, cues my sadest, "one-that-got-away-tale," about guns. During the Hugh O'Brien/Wyatt Earp on TV run, you could send in somewhere and get a life-sized, Colt .45 Buntline Special, with a 12" barrel and fully engraved - all in plastic, of course, from, I think, Monogram models. Having the best Daddy in the world, he ordered me one. One of those presents not for your birthday nor Christmas nor St. Swithen's Day or any occasion - just 'cause he knew how much I'd like it. It stayed up on top of the bookcase in the living room and he'd get it down for me on Tuesday nights to help Wyatt. I'd trade my .357 for that plastic model! Used to have a Mattel, "snub-nose .38, too, that shot Mattel's, "Shootin' Shells." It came with a shoulder holster. The gun was unreal ... it had formed grip panels, larger than the gun frame - very similar to the later model, actual Colt DS, which hadn't been born yet. It used a side loading port, like a SAA. Loved those toy guns! FWW, there's a web page from someone or other that translates the Latin Doc and Johnny Ringo exchange. Guess it's authentic. In that era, a university education automatically included Latin and/or Greek. Scholars were expected to study the classic authors in their native tongue - not translations. And, Doc particularly, being a dentist, would have had more than a little Latin study. My favorite, "Doc-ism," is from the Costner version. Wyatt takes Doc out of harm's way in a fight with Kate and sticks his head in the horse trough. He shakes him around and asks, rhetorically, "What's wrong with you?" Doc answers, "What have you got!?"

 

[dfariswheel]

I had dreams that some really GREAT director like John Millus would cast Sam Elliot, Tom Selleck, and some other good actor as "The Three Guardsmen", Heck Thomas, Chris Madsen, and Bill Tilgman.

These three men set the standard for American law men for the last 100 years.

They've never been done properly or well in any movie.

Lee Marvin WAS great in the "Man Who Shot Liberty Valance", but for sheer QUIET menace, nobody ever out did Palance.
He never raised his voice, no sneering, no leering, no histrionics, nothing over the top.

The only "sour note" in the movie was, whoever costumed Alan Ladd should have been shot. The crummy hat and the buckskin didn't fit.

 

[rcwambold]

YOu know, since we've lived in SW Kansas for the last 20+ years, I've read everything I can on the, "real," gunfighters and such. The main street in Dodge City is Wyatt Earp Blvd. The Sante Fe rr yard sits just along the blvd., as it did on Front Street, when Wyatt actually walked along it. There are newspaper articles about Policeman Earp and/or Deputy Masterson - Bat later became Sheriff of Ford County and his brother Ed was killed in the line of duty here. He's buried out a Ft. Dodge. They picked up drunken Indians off the reservation and took barking dog complaints and a load of crap, just like their modern counterparts. The clothing and holsters and guns always intrigue me. If Earp EVER used a holster, I still don't know about it. Their dress looks a lot more Victorian era than Wild West, if you take my meaning. The, "Boot Hill Museum," still has a wonderful gun display. They decided to sell of much of it a while back to raise funds for buildings but they've still got one-of-everything.
"They piled the stiffs outside the door,"
I reckon there was a cord or more.
And that winter, as a rule,
the girls went alone to spelling school."

I reckon there was a cord or more.

 

[dfariswheel]

According to people who knew, Earp had his pants custom-made with extra large pockets, lined with stiff, waxed canvas.

Those were his "holsters".

One writer said that the old Lawmen/gambler/gunmen all dressed like their closest aquaintance.....the undertaker.

That would be the Victorian frock coat fashion.

 

[rcwambold]

That's a pip! The undertaker line, I mean. My favorite Earp story, so far, goes like this: It's a howling blizzard in Lost-in-the-Woods, Alaska and the few locals that could get out in are holed up in the local gin-mill, playing cards and killing time. A tall stranger comes in, shaking snow from his hat and coat and starts to warm himself at the stove. The local, "tought guy," starts to pick a fight, just like they do in the movies and in bars all around the world, still. Finally, it gets to the point where the bad guy is imitating, "dueling," practice and takes out a glove and is about to slap the stranger. Mr. Stranger, who has ignored everything thrown at him so far, looks up and says, "If you do that, that'll be the worst mistake you EVER made." "Oh, yeah? What's your name, anyway? "Wyatt Earp." "Oh. (pause.) Can I buy you a drink?" "Certainly." end of story.